Thomas and Frank look for common ground between two very different 90s films in their latest set of back-to-back movie reviews.
First, Frank reviews "No Escape" (1994). Then, Thomas reviews "Rushmore" (1998).
It's an almost entirely unrelated Double Feature, and it starts right now!
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Meet Your Double Feature is a double-blind movie review podcast hosted by brothers Thomas and Frank. Thomas is an event producer and broadcaster from Chicago. Frank is an independent filmmaker living in Los Angeles.
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For full episodes, written reviews and more, visit our website at https://www.MeetYourDoubleFeature.com/
For more information on where to watch "Nate and Moriah in Venice" (which Frank co-produced!), visit https://www.sardonicmp.com/
Follow us on Socials at:
Instagram.com/meetyourdoublefeature
https://bsky.app/profile/mydfpod.bsky.social
Music for tonight's show licensed through Soundstripe
"The Shakedown" by Dresden, The Flamingo
"Soul Tonic" by Cast of Characters
"Sophistikitty" by Cast of Characters
Source for Bill Murray "Rushmore" quotes:
https://collider.com/bill-murray-rushmore/
(00:00) Intro
(00:41) No Escape (1994)
(44:21) Rushmore (1998)
(01:21:36) Final Scores and Wrap-Up
(01:37:10) Outro
00:00:09
Tonight on Meet Your Double feature, imprisoned Marine John
00:00:13
Robbins battles a maniacal warden and island cannibals in
00:00:17
the sci-fi action thriller No Escape.
00:00:20
Then teenage Academy student Max Fisher grapples with painful
00:00:24
loves and unlikely friendships in the coming of age comedy
00:00:27
Rushmore. It's an almost entirely
00:00:30
unrelated double feature, and it starts right now.
00:00:41
Hello and welcome to Meet Your Double Feature, a double-blind
00:00:44
movie review podcast. My name is Thomas, joined as
00:00:46
always by my brother Frank. Frank, how are you today?
00:00:49
I'm so excited. He's so excited.
00:00:51
He's like that song, so excited. I was thinking of Saved by the
00:00:55
Bell. Oh yeah, when she's on the
00:00:58
caffeine pills. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 'cause in that
00:01:01
she's actually scared, as she says afterwards.
00:01:02
Anyway, welcome to the show. If you've never joined us before
00:01:06
here at MEET Your Double Feature.
00:01:07
This is a back-to-back movie review podcast with a bit of A
00:01:10
twist. The way it works is that Frank
00:01:12
and I have both selected a movie for the other to watch and
00:01:15
review today that neither of us had seen previously.
00:01:18
We're just making our best guess about what the other person
00:01:20
might like. We're going to review both of
00:01:22
those films, give each one a score out of 10, and whoever
00:01:24
gave the better blind movie pick for this episode will be
00:01:28
declared the winner. We're also going to keep track
00:01:31
of scores as we go in Season 1 so far, which this is episode 9,
00:01:35
I'm still ahead by like 4 or five points, I think.
00:01:38
But Frank, you did win our previous episode for the first
00:01:41
time in a while. You got a big win.
00:01:43
So maybe the the turn around starts now.
00:01:44
What do you think? Oh I, I know.
00:01:46
So the momentum is going my way. The momentum's going While back,
00:01:51
he gave himself a halftime pep talk that appears to have been
00:01:53
paying dividends. We'll see if I can I can cut him
00:01:55
off or if he will win the day once again, Frank, that actually
00:01:59
leads us right into our first review.
00:02:00
So you're going to kick us off with the movie I asked you to
00:02:03
watch, which was 1994's No Escape starring Ray Liotta.
00:02:08
I cannot for the life of me remember anything about this
00:02:12
movie, which is a common problem we run into here.
00:02:14
I think it's a science fiction film.
00:02:16
And I don't know, I just like Ray Liotta.
00:02:19
And I like the idea that a couple years off of something
00:02:21
like Goodfellas, like, you know, like a very high art mafia
00:02:25
thriller. It's like, you know what?
00:02:26
What if he was like a spaceman? Yeah, yes.
00:02:30
Well, that's my first note that I have written down here about
00:02:34
this movie. Is weird to cast Ray Liotta in a
00:02:38
movie that's not? Goodfellas question mark.
00:02:40
Yeah, like any other movie, I think he should just stay where
00:02:44
he was in Goodfellas. Which that that being said,
00:02:48
Raylo is a great actor. It's just like it was like, I
00:02:52
don't know, I haven't seen him in much else like so it was like
00:02:55
almost off putting to see him and just like standard sci-fi
00:02:59
action movie. It's a weird.
00:03:01
Fit it is. It is, and we'll get into it if
00:03:04
it works for him or not. But I believe from some of my
00:03:09
reading, I was doing that after watching the film that it was
00:03:12
something that he wanted to do. Like it.
00:03:14
Oh, OK Was like a goal of his to be like, you know, the lead in
00:03:19
like a action film where he gets to play the hero.
00:03:23
What's the what's the line from Goodfellas for?
00:03:25
He's like, ever since I was a kid, I wanted to be a gangster,
00:03:28
but he's like, Nope, spaceman. Spaceman Yeah, this doesn't take
00:03:32
place in space, actually. Are you messed up, Leota?
00:03:39
I mean, he didn't. He didn't say that.
00:03:42
Oh, OK. Sorry, I'm imprinting.
00:03:46
You just want to be action hero man.
00:03:48
Ever since I was a kid, I wanted Ray Leota to be a spaceman.
00:03:53
To Infinity and beyond. Ray Liotta.
00:03:57
Yeah, OK, we're on Earth. We're on Earth then.
00:03:59
But it's still are we in the future?
00:04:01
Yeah, so I'm this is this is the other thing I wanted to so the
00:04:04
film opens with which these are always funny.
00:04:07
Those films that were made in like the 80s, nineties and and
00:04:12
they would always pick like a future date.
00:04:14
You know, it's like the year is is this one is 2022.
00:04:19
Oh recent. Yeah, well, that's, it's funny
00:04:21
because I'm going to read it's it's short, so I'm going to read
00:04:24
it verbatim. The the opening text, this one,
00:04:30
it just might be the most. I think they they nailed it
00:04:32
actually. So, so the phone just opens and
00:04:35
it says in the year 2022, the international prison system is
00:04:40
operated by private corporations.
00:04:43
Criminals from all over the world are exploited at a profit.
00:04:47
Prisons have become big businesses.
00:04:49
That is 100% factually correct. Yeah, that's a, that's a news
00:04:54
article that they've made. Yeah.
00:04:57
No notes. They got that.
00:04:59
No notes. Probably the most accurate one
00:05:04
of those I've ever seen. Yeah, the prison industrial
00:05:08
complex is a thing. Bummer.
00:05:11
Bummer. So that was right away.
00:05:15
Like I was just like, oh man. Cuz then the movie begins and,
00:05:19
and, you know, it has a sort of like sci-fi aesthetic to it.
00:05:22
And they're throwing Ray Liotta in this like futuristic prison.
00:05:25
And, and there's like, like a robotic warden voice saying, you
00:05:30
know, you're you're going to be here forever and all this stuff.
00:05:33
And I'm like wow, I'm in for a fun time.
00:05:36
Yep, who loves? Who loves anything more than a
00:05:40
good old fashioned depressing prison movie?
00:05:44
Yes it doesn't stay there though.
00:05:46
It it goes to a different place. So we'll we'll get into that.
00:05:49
But I mean, yeah, just right away I was like, Oh my God.
00:05:51
Just like on a personal level, I'm like, this is one of my
00:05:54
worst nightmares. So I'm.
00:05:56
Like, Oh, yeah, just to be, to be, you know, convicted of all
00:06:01
your crimes and to face justice or allegedly, allegedly,
00:06:06
allegedly, allegedly. I just can't imagine actually
00:06:11
paying for what I've done. Listen, listen.
00:06:18
Yeah, Yeah. We can talk about that off
00:06:19
airplane. We'll cut that.
00:06:20
We'll cut. That off, yeah, yeah.
00:06:23
But no, it was it was just like I was prepared to be horribly
00:06:28
depressed the entire time watching this film.
00:06:30
But then it like really early on just makes an interesting twist
00:06:35
where and I'll I'll just kind of briefly get into the beginning
00:06:39
of the story, I guess. But like, you know, really he's
00:06:42
thrown in this in this future tech prison and he like right
00:06:46
away has beef with like the warden and the warden to punish
00:06:52
him. This is like his first, like
00:06:54
step one. He's like, all right, this guy
00:06:56
stepped out of line, throw him on the island, and then they
00:07:00
just immediately take him out of this prison and drop him off on
00:07:04
like a forest island nearby. And I'm like, Oh well, this is
00:07:10
100 times better like. Yeah, that seems like a
00:07:12
significant improvement. Yeah, I was like, why would you
00:07:15
ever like this? Is the punishment like you get?
00:07:18
Yeah, if you act out of line one more time, we're going to let
00:07:21
you go. Exactly.
00:07:23
I was just like, I was like, wait, this feels really
00:07:27
backwards. This is a really pretty island
00:07:28
he's on now, like, and that's where the rest of the film takes
00:07:31
place. So I was like, OK, good.
00:07:33
OK, all right. This is great.
00:07:37
Yeah, relax. Nothing else bad will happen.
00:07:40
Yeah, yeah. And then and, you know, and
00:07:42
then, then it, it, it gets into things and you see why that's
00:07:45
that's a bad thing. But I couldn't help thinking
00:07:47
that the entire time I was waiting for that point where I
00:07:50
was like, yeah. But like, personally, at what
00:07:52
point would you rather be back in that prison?
00:07:55
You know what I mean? And I was like.
00:07:56
I don't think I ever really got there.
00:07:58
I'm going to assume there's some other side to this where it's
00:08:01
like you're on an island full of dinosaurs or mutant monsters or
00:08:05
something, but Even so, fresh air can't beat the fresh air,
00:08:08
dude. Fresh air, lush greenery, like
00:08:11
you're just like, especially because of the way that they
00:08:16
like literally as these prisoners are being LED in,
00:08:18
they're like, you're going to die here.
00:08:19
You're never leaving. And it's like, right, Well, I
00:08:22
mean, yeah, I guess I'd rather like, live my last moments on
00:08:26
this beautiful island than in that.
00:08:28
Disgusting. Prison cell.
00:08:29
They forgot to show the part where they're like, if you're on
00:08:31
your best behavior, you'll die in prison.
00:08:34
Yeah, exactly, exactly you. Step out of line.
00:08:40
I swear we're going to send you on the first train out of here.
00:08:42
And they're like, no, wait. Oh, no.
00:08:44
So, yeah, yeah. So that was that was good.
00:08:51
That was good. I was, I was immediately, I was
00:08:53
like, I was, I saw the, I saw the, the points total going
00:08:56
down. You were like quickly spiraling
00:09:00
towards grifter's levels. And then I was just like, OK,
00:09:02
all right, all right. That has been the implicit
00:09:05
threat in our episode so far, is you towing the light of making
00:09:08
me watch weird art films and me just giving you really sad
00:09:12
movies. Yeah, yeah.
00:09:15
I was like you do. You got me again.
00:09:18
Take that making me watch fallen angels I'm.
00:09:24
Going to keep them coming. Yeah.
00:09:26
So anyway, that is is where we go from there.
00:09:30
OK, so no escape, not a huge bummer, just that's a that's an
00:09:34
inciting action as he goes to jail and then goes to some sort
00:09:36
of prison island. Yes, which I get like, I don't
00:09:40
know, maybe the movie was marketed that way actually, but
00:09:43
going in blind, like that's not the direction I expected to go.
00:09:46
And he's like, oh, we're it's no escape from this island and like
00:09:51
to get into it. The danger of this island that
00:09:54
he encounters immediately is all the other prisoners that have
00:09:59
been sent there have sort of formed like gangs on the island.
00:10:04
And they're like cannibalistic because it's sort of revealed
00:10:09
through the story that like this prison ward.
00:10:12
And this is not, this is like something he does for fun or to
00:10:16
like punish these prisoners. Like he's not supposed to be
00:10:18
doing this. But this is his kind of like
00:10:21
special form of punishment or entertainment for himself.
00:10:24
Is is sending these prisoners out onto this island and just
00:10:27
letting them fend for themselves.
00:10:29
Yeah, he's just doing a little Squid Game or something on the
00:10:31
side, just. On the side, just a little side
00:10:33
action for the word. Side he gets his paperwork done.
00:10:37
OK, jeez. Somebody that gets it done.
00:10:41
Yeah, it gets done, I guess. But you know, just let me have
00:10:44
the Squid Game. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:10:47
So right away Ray Liotta encounters these these group of
00:10:51
of cannibalistic prisoners that have been left behind on this
00:10:54
island. And the leader of this group
00:10:58
that he encounters. I, I want to highlight him right
00:11:00
away because he is without a doubt the highlight of the film.
00:11:04
OK, is it's the actor's name is Stuart Wilson.
00:11:09
And from his first line of dialogue, I was like, that's the
00:11:12
bad guy from Ninja Turtles three.
00:11:15
Wait, what? Yes, he was.
00:11:18
He was. Walker was his name in that film
00:11:20
in. Oh, the white guy bad guy from
00:11:22
Ninja Turtles 3. The guy with the birds.
00:11:24
The guy selling them the gunpowder and stuff, OK.
00:11:28
Interesting. Yeah he was also probably more
00:11:31
like well known for being. I think he was also the bad guy
00:11:35
in the Mask of Zorro. That's arguably more well known
00:11:38
than Ninja Turtles 3. Of them, I'd say exactly.
00:11:41
I know my audience. I know who I'm talking to here,
00:11:43
yeah. Exactly.
00:11:44
Ninja Turtles. Let's hone in on that.
00:11:47
Yes, yes. And he's great in everything.
00:11:51
I've seen him in actually all three of those films.
00:11:53
So like. There you go.
00:11:56
But he's so good in this. I mean, he he walks that line so
00:12:01
well. But between being just like the
00:12:04
kind of fun, goofy villain while still being genuinely
00:12:08
intimidating, which is is a narrow and difficult line to
00:12:11
walk. Actually, like some villains,
00:12:15
you know, especially with their performances, they might if you
00:12:18
just sway just a little bit. It's like this guy's too
00:12:19
likable. He's too fun, you know, or he's,
00:12:21
you know, or he's being too wacky and it's just like not
00:12:25
landing anywhere really. But he's like perfect in this.
00:12:29
And I was like, oh, this is awesome.
00:12:30
He just brings so much charisma to this whole thing, which is
00:12:34
this film really needed. So like, that's why I just
00:12:37
wanted to get to him right away because I'm like, he holds this
00:12:40
whole thing together with his. Character and his performance,
00:12:45
because again, we're always picking based on casts.
00:12:47
And I knew that I thought you were going to talk about Lance
00:12:50
Hendrickson because he's in this, right?
00:12:52
Yes, yeah, Lance Hendrickson is great.
00:12:54
What? What are you most familiar with
00:12:57
him for? For me Lance Hendrickson is kind
00:12:59
of just sci-fi franchise guy. I think he has some sort of
00:13:03
accolade where he's like the only actor to be killed on
00:13:07
screen by a xenomorph, the Predator and some other famous
00:13:13
sci-fi. Oh, maybe it's the thing or
00:13:16
something like he has been. Killed in so many, like famous
00:13:19
sci-fi movies that it's like he's checked, he's checked a
00:13:22
bunch of boxes. Yeah, absolutely.
00:13:24
He he yeah, he's he's great in this as well.
00:13:27
Like the first thing I thought because his voice is so
00:13:29
distinctive. And again, another sci-fi
00:13:32
property he's connected to is he's he's the voice of Admiral
00:13:35
Hackett in the Mass Effect games.
00:13:38
Oh yeah, I never placed that. But you're right, that's totally
00:13:41
him. Yeah, yeah.
00:13:42
So like, I was like, again, like the first line, he spoke.
00:13:45
I was like, Oh yeah, that guy. Like people would probably be
00:13:48
most familiar with him from the Alien films I think.
00:13:51
Cuz he was in the second one. He was an alien, so he was their
00:13:55
like Android guy. Yes.
00:13:56
Which people love aliens both as a statement and as the title of
00:14:01
a movie. Right, right.
00:14:03
Yeah, just generally speaking. Just generally, they're a fan.
00:14:06
OK, cool. So I'm glad that the cast helps
00:14:09
'cause I will say it's a coin flip for me whether Ray Liotta
00:14:12
would add or detract from this particular movie 'cause he's a
00:14:15
great actor. But I could see him not meshing.
00:14:17
So here's the thing with with with Ray, our good buddy Ray, he
00:14:24
his performance was reminding me, especially in the first
00:14:27
half. He kind of there are some
00:14:29
moments where he sort of breaks free from this.
00:14:31
But it was reminding me of exactly what you said about
00:14:34
Bruce Willis in the Jackal, where his character is, is for a
00:14:40
majority of the film just sort of this like silent brooding
00:14:44
type. And it just looks like Ray Leona
00:14:48
just showed up and stared at the camera that day, like.
00:14:51
You know what I mean? I've seen that in many other
00:14:54
films too. You need, you need either very
00:14:57
competent directing or something communicated to the audience
00:15:02
that lets you know what they might be thinking about for that
00:15:05
to ever work. Because otherwise it does feel
00:15:07
like they're just not really invested in the performance.
00:15:09
Like, I'm sure Ray Leota had a lot of thoughts in his head
00:15:11
about what this guy's going on about, but if the movie doesn't
00:15:15
set you up, you're just like, what's he doing?
00:15:17
Why isn't he talking? Yes, exactly.
00:15:20
And the way the movie is structured and like, given the
00:15:23
premise to that, these are all people that have wound up in
00:15:26
this prison facility. There's like several characters
00:15:30
along the way that you meet. And then a few of them have
00:15:34
scenes where they kind of reveal why they got sent there in the
00:15:38
1st place. And, you know, people are kind
00:15:41
of trying to figure out why Ray Liotta got sent there.
00:15:44
They do say actually in the beginning of the film that he
00:15:48
was in the military and he killed his commanding officer
00:15:52
and that's why he got sent there.
00:15:56
And then there's a lot of dialogue about him, you know,
00:15:59
being very anti authority, which is why he gets it into it with
00:16:02
the warden right away at the beginning of the film.
00:16:05
But they don't, it's not till the end of the film where it's
00:16:08
kind of revealed like why he did that and why he kind of has this
00:16:12
like PTSD. And so it's kind of like, like
00:16:16
looking backwards it, it informs why he's acting the way he is
00:16:20
for most of the movie. But for the front half of that
00:16:24
movie, it's just like Ray's just giving you nothing, you know?
00:16:27
It's nothing. Yeah.
00:16:30
You need to have like, louder characteristics surrounding the
00:16:33
performance too. Like, I think an example of this
00:16:35
that works is Kurt Russell in Escape from New York, the snake
00:16:41
Plissken character. Yeah.
00:16:42
Because absolutely is really quiet, very Moody.
00:16:47
There's a bit and escape from New York like somewhere in the
00:16:50
second act where he's like in a similar boat.
00:16:52
He's in like a prison island essentially trying to track
00:16:55
somebody down and he just finds like a folding chair and just
00:16:57
sits in it because he's just tired.
00:16:59
And he's just like man. But it works.
00:17:01
It's like unspoken charisma. But that's partially because
00:17:05
he's like kind of cartoonish in how he's portrayed over all.
00:17:09
He feels like an anime character.
00:17:11
If it's too grounded, like sounds like maybe Ray Liotta is
00:17:14
indefinitely with the Jackal, when I talked about that, you
00:17:18
just have nothing to latch onto. It's not cool, it's not like
00:17:21
brooding. It's just nothing.
00:17:23
Yeah, yeah, 'cause like an Escape from New York.
00:17:26
I, I just love that movie. That's that's like one of my all
00:17:28
time favorites, like, and, and it's exactly like you said,
00:17:30
it's, it's cartoonish. It's like, can't be in a way,
00:17:32
because something that helps in that situation with Kurt
00:17:37
Russell's character is everywhere he goes in that
00:17:40
movie. People know him or have heard of
00:17:42
him like even. Though it's like the point of
00:17:44
absurdity. To the point of absurdity.
00:17:46
It's like, this is a prison. Why would anyone here know who
00:17:49
he is? But instead, every single
00:17:51
person, they're like, oh, Snake Pliskins here.
00:17:52
Like, you know. Man, but yeah, and even people
00:17:56
who shouldn't be excited about anything, it's like, oh, we, we
00:17:58
found our own like, cannibal corner over here.
00:18:00
But like the head cannibals, they're like, ah, snake.
00:18:02
I love that guy. No, you don't.
00:18:03
Why? Why?
00:18:04
Yeah, like it's. It's insane.
00:18:08
Even we talked in an episode not long ago about the movie
00:18:11
Roadhouse with Patrick Swayze, and he's another one who's like
00:18:14
a fairly quiet character, but his reputation precedes him.
00:18:17
People are talking about him ripping throats out for some
00:18:19
reason. There's lore about him.
00:18:23
And then the characterization is like, how much of that is true?
00:18:26
Do we get anything for Ray Leona from the other character's
00:18:28
perspective, or is he just some guy?
00:18:30
No, it's it's like from the beginning of the film, it's like
00:18:34
the warden has his eye on. It's like literally the the
00:18:37
beginning of the film is, is they're like taking like a train
00:18:39
full of these prisoners into this sci-fi complex.
00:18:44
And he's like looking over his profile and he's you know, like,
00:18:47
oh, you know, this guy has all this combat experience and you
00:18:51
know, it sets him up as like action military man.
00:18:54
And some of the other characters comments on that too.
00:18:58
And then you kind of see it with the, with the way like,
00:19:00
especially once he gets to the island and even before then,
00:19:03
like, you know, the, the warden, there's a scene where he's
00:19:06
trying to like get Ray Liotta to like fall in line and he kind of
00:19:11
takes his, his cellmate and, and wants Ray Leota to like tase him
00:19:16
with this thing, you know, to like punish him.
00:19:19
And then Ray Leota like quickly like takes one of the guards
00:19:22
guns and like holds it up to the warden's head, You know, so it's
00:19:25
like you see right away that he that he has this kind of like
00:19:28
how capable he is in that manner.
00:19:31
But it's it's it's nothing like like those other films we're
00:19:36
describing where it's like both of those sort of existed in a
00:19:41
cartoonish universe, whereas this one tries to play it more
00:19:44
grounded. So it just doesn't do as much of
00:19:49
that heavy lifting to inform his character.
00:19:51
I. Think right, so it definitely
00:19:52
sounds like they tried to communicate character through
00:19:55
action, but if you then drop him into a space with other
00:19:59
charismatic performers and he still has to just be that guy.
00:20:03
That's kind of a recipe for failure for your lead character.
00:20:06
Yeah, yeah. And I mean, he gets to show
00:20:09
later in the film like his character has this this PTSD.
00:20:13
And so it's there's kind of like several scenes where we're in
00:20:16
wherever he sees things like on fire, it's sort of like triggers
00:20:19
that for him. And so he has these moments
00:20:23
where he gets to emote, you know, and, and it's all just
00:20:26
very like visual, like facial performance.
00:20:30
And that's good. I'm like, well, this is what you
00:20:31
bring Ray Leona in for? Right, a legit dramatic actor.
00:20:35
Yeah, exactly. But it it yeah, it's just in
00:20:38
those other moments, it's hard to get behind him as this sort
00:20:43
of heroic lead because he's just not saying anything.
00:20:50
You know, it's a kind of like you have no idea.
00:20:52
And and I think that was kind of something I was thinking about.
00:20:54
This movie, generally speaking, is like, you know, it's set in
00:20:57
this sci-fi universe, but it doesn't do enough in my opinion
00:21:03
to kind of show you like, like how this world works, you know,
00:21:07
like what's going on. Especially since we spend the
00:21:10
entire film just on this island and then that brief like time in
00:21:14
the beginning where they're just in this sci-fi prison place.
00:21:18
It's like, I don't understand what this world is, you know,
00:21:22
like, or where. So it's like, I don't even know
00:21:24
where this character is coming from.
00:21:26
So I don't have enough. There's just very little to
00:21:28
latch on to and clock the time to book.
00:21:33
This one was in the opening credits.
00:21:35
It said it was based on a novel. Yeah.
00:21:38
Gosh, I think I've given you almost nothing but book movies.
00:21:41
I I'm not even doing that on purpose.
00:21:43
Well, it's a common thing. I mean, that's, I mean, we've
00:21:45
said it before, like, you know, that's since the history of
00:21:49
cinema they've been adapted from, you know.
00:21:52
Man, on paper this looks like such a like action movie script.
00:21:55
It did not look like a book treatment.
00:21:57
That is actually a surprise for me.
00:21:59
I. Will say from what I saw I it I
00:22:02
don't think it's like a 1 to 1 adaptation though.
00:22:07
I think it was maybe loosely adapted from a book and maybe
00:22:12
that's where things kind of got lost almost because.
00:22:17
I could see that. It just feels like a confusing
00:22:19
world, you know? It's like, I, I just don't
00:22:22
understand, like actually to, to kind of get into once he's on
00:22:27
the island, you know, he, he, he encounters Stuart Wilson Walker
00:22:33
from Ninja Turtles and his, his kind of band of cannibals and he
00:22:37
escapes from them and then he finds the other camp, which is
00:22:41
where Lance Hedrickson and Ernie Hudson are.
00:22:44
Oh, Ernie Hudson's here. I forgot we got a Ghostbuster.
00:22:47
Yeah, he doesn't do much. He just kind of shows.
00:22:50
Up. He doesn't.
00:22:50
He doesn't bring his proton back.
00:22:52
No, I mean, he's fine. Actually.
00:22:53
He's he's just gives a very serviceable performance and and
00:22:58
he's great. You know, he he just has sort of
00:22:59
a natural charisma to him. So it was, it was nice to kind
00:23:02
of have him be a part of the your little good guy group.
00:23:06
But he meets up with them and and they're on the part of the
00:23:09
island where, like, the prisoners there have formed like
00:23:12
a little community. They've like built little huts
00:23:15
and they're sort of living off the land and like farming.
00:23:17
And they're like, oh, yeah, You know, like we kind of are almost
00:23:20
at war with this other clan over here that the the cannibals and
00:23:28
Ray Liotta's like, I got to get out of here.
00:23:29
I got to go off this island, you know, And they're like, well,
00:23:31
why not just stay here? I mean, you know, you have this
00:23:33
little community here and throughout the whole movie, I'm,
00:23:37
I'm thinking the same thing that they're saying.
00:23:39
I'm like, yeah, why not just stay here?
00:23:40
Like, I don't know what the outside world is.
00:23:42
I don't know. You know, it's like you.
00:23:43
Are that's a great point. You can't make a prison story
00:23:46
and not strongly communicate what is just outside that
00:23:50
barrier for the characters. Like you need to know what
00:23:54
they're envisioning as. Like as soon as I get out of
00:23:56
here, I'm going to go, you know, to this place or to see this
00:24:00
person. Yeah.
00:24:01
And it's like we have no idea what this cuz, you know, this
00:24:03
this film was made in the 90s, but it's set in this future,
00:24:06
2022 that they've envisioned. What does the rest of that world
00:24:09
look like outside of where we are in this story?
00:24:13
And it's revealed at the end, the reason that he really wants
00:24:18
to get off the island is to sort of reveal to the world, to the
00:24:22
public the reason that he, you know, went AWOL and killed his
00:24:26
commanding officer was because his commanding officer, like,
00:24:31
ordered him and his troops to go do this horrible thing.
00:24:35
And like, that just felt kind of weak to me, you know, cuz it's
00:24:38
like not revealed up until the end.
00:24:40
And it's like you spend the rest of the time trying to
00:24:43
understand, I guess, the perspective of this character
00:24:47
and what he's aiming to do because he's just constantly
00:24:50
saying, like, I got to get out of here.
00:24:52
And then the other characters are like, why?
00:24:54
And then as the audience, I'm asking the same thing, you know,
00:24:57
like it's not. Yeah, it's not really personal
00:24:59
enough. Like I know like logistically,
00:25:01
yes, that is a good reason. But that's something you could
00:25:03
reveal earlier on. And I feel like you need like
00:25:06
it's, it'd be an easy thing to do, but it should just be like,
00:25:10
I got to get back to my daughter or something, you know?
00:25:13
Yeah, exactly. Give him something.
00:25:14
Give him something relatable like that, you know, that that a
00:25:19
general audience member can attach to and he just has
00:25:22
nothing like there's nothing to kind of like latch onto with
00:25:26
this character. And so I, I think it suffers for
00:25:29
that. Yeah, for sure.
00:25:31
Because it just had me sitting there asking so many follow up
00:25:33
questions in my head, you know, just trying to like understand
00:25:37
the, the world of the film. Yeah, which that's a problem
00:25:40
with editing to like that's so much the rhythm of a film
00:25:44
arrangement is like giving the audience a question to Mull
00:25:47
over, but then giving them the answer in the right amount of
00:25:50
time so that they're not like. Distracted thinking about it.
00:25:53
Totally, totally. Yeah.
00:25:54
Because like I said, they're doing this with all the
00:25:55
characters. You know, it's kind of like,
00:25:57
like Lance Henrickson's character is sort of like the
00:26:01
leader of this this village community that they've set up on
00:26:05
the other side of the island. And everyone kind of like, you
00:26:08
know, reveres him. But like the characters talk
00:26:11
about like, oh, they say he killed his wife, but he claims
00:26:15
he didn't. And so then there's a scene
00:26:17
between him and and Ray Leota later where he like admits that
00:26:21
he did, you know, and he kind of has scenes with several of the
00:26:24
characters where they're like revealing their back story that
00:26:27
way. And then you get Ray Liotta's
00:26:29
version of that like near the very end.
00:26:31
I will say I don't like the trope where the people in prison
00:26:34
all did a bad thing except the POV character who like did a
00:26:37
morally justified thing. I think he should have also done
00:26:40
a bad thing. Well, that's something he kind
00:26:42
of did because. Yeah, I guess he kind.
00:26:45
Of he was ordered to do it, but he did do it and that like
00:26:50
that's why. He did do the war crime.
00:26:53
He did. Oh, for sure, he did.
00:26:54
Oh, I'm sorry, I misunderstood. I thought he was like, no.
00:26:57
And then he he shot the guy. So he did the war crime and then
00:27:00
OK, never mind retraction. Yeah, his.
00:27:02
Version of the story that he tells in the film is like he was
00:27:07
like him and his guys were ordered into like just like a
00:27:10
peaceful village and they like massacred everybody there and
00:27:16
he's like, oh, I knew, you know, I tried telling my commanding
00:27:19
officer that, you know, there was no enemy troops here and
00:27:22
that we shouldn't do this, but he ordered us in anyway.
00:27:25
And so then him and his men, they actually went and did it.
00:27:28
And then when he came back, that's when he like killed his
00:27:32
commanding officer and then. Sounds very Vietnam coded.
00:27:37
It felt that way, which again though, but it's like, what is
00:27:39
this world that we're in? Like tell me more, you know?
00:27:42
And was. This was this our world, but
00:27:44
just further in the future? Or was it a world where like
00:27:47
that progressed completely differently and that's where I
00:27:50
won Massachusetts. OK, is.
00:27:52
Massachusetts even a thing? Did it ever in?
00:27:54
Massachusetts there. Can I go there now?
00:27:57
Is that where he's going? Where is she?
00:27:59
Is she safe? She.
00:28:02
Well, that was that was Anakin. That was his.
00:28:05
Oh, oh, oh, OK, OK. Sorry I.
00:28:07
Missed a perfect a good Star Wars reference?
00:28:09
That's on. Me just left me hanging there.
00:28:12
It's fine. I'm sorry I.
00:28:13
Thought you were just really personifying Massachusetts and
00:28:15
she and I was like, all right, sorry, please continue.
00:28:19
It's fine, it's fine. But that to me felt like I like
00:28:24
again, I just felt like felt myself asking these questions
00:28:27
and I was like, was this lost in translation from the book?
00:28:29
Was literally like more of a back story given here and like
00:28:32
is when this is adapted to film? Is that what we're losing?
00:28:35
But anyway, I don't want to, like, harp on that too much, but
00:28:38
it was just something I felt like kept coming up throughout
00:28:41
the film. Yeah, I guess I'm trying to, I'm
00:28:45
trying to encapsulate my understanding of the film so
00:28:47
far. I think we've touched a lot on
00:28:48
performances and character motivations.
00:28:52
Is it like a just scene by scene?
00:28:56
Is this like an action sci-fi movie or is it more of just like
00:28:58
a drama? No, it's for sure an action
00:29:00
sci-fi, and that's something I wanted to get into because there
00:29:03
are like epic action sequences in this.
00:29:08
Yeah, yeah. And those are actually really
00:29:11
well done. They're really well shot, really
00:29:12
well executed. Great 90s like stunt
00:29:17
performances, explosions, like all that good stuff.
00:29:23
And you know, it comes from these kind of like warring
00:29:26
tribes essentially on this island.
00:29:30
And there's a lot of like back and forth with like Ray Liotta
00:29:33
and Stuart Wilson's character, the leader of the the enemy
00:29:37
group. So it does set all that up for
00:29:43
like if that's what you went in looking for, you would not be
00:29:46
disappointed. You get plenty of.
00:29:47
OK, good that say you don't care about these characters and
00:29:52
plots, you just want to see action.
00:29:55
Yeah, yeah. I mean, there was genuinely,
00:29:57
there was like some camera moves, especially where I was
00:30:01
like, whoa, that like there's caught me off guard because they
00:30:03
were so like fun and interesting.
00:30:04
Like at one point there's like Ray Liotta, like there's this
00:30:07
dude, like running at him and like, the camera is like
00:30:10
following behind the guy and like Ray Liotta like grabs his
00:30:13
head and like slams it into like a pole.
00:30:15
And like the camera like moves with the person who like as he's
00:30:19
being thrown. And it was, I'm just like, this
00:30:21
is great. This is action that is
00:30:23
incredibly well shot. Especially for the time, that's
00:30:26
easy to do now with camera tech and drone shots instead.
00:30:30
But to do that with a camera rig in 1994, that's impressive.
00:30:35
Absolutely shot on film and just in what looks like, you know, I
00:30:39
don't know where this location was, but visually, I mean it
00:30:43
was, you know, they were they were in like a jungle or forest
00:30:46
of some kind, like as it was supposed to be this island and
00:30:50
with really impressive like set design too, because you know, it
00:30:54
was like this kind of makeshift community that they built up.
00:30:57
So it was like like amazing production design there.
00:31:00
Awesome. OK, cool.
00:31:01
See, I, I hadn't got, I hadn't gleaned that yet because we
00:31:03
focused a lot on narrative, but I'm glad that the, the sci-fi
00:31:07
elements kind of kind of landed. Totally.
00:31:09
And and to touch on that a little bit more too with like
00:31:12
how well the action was shot. The director of this film is
00:31:16
Martin Campbell, who was the director of both Goldeneye and
00:31:21
Casino Royale 2006. Casino Royale, which is.
00:31:24
Oh. OK, an amazing like that's like
00:31:27
the best James Bond movie for me.
00:31:30
Personally, I would I would say it's maybe the only good one
00:31:33
I'll put that on. Goldeneye.
00:31:35
Goldeneye is fun too, but but maybe Goldeneye is more
00:31:37
associated with like the video game.
00:31:39
I think some of the movies are fun, but in terms of ones that
00:31:42
actually are just like good films, good to great films,
00:31:45
Casino Royale for most 6 is like the best.
00:31:48
Anyway, I'll get off that soapbox.
00:31:49
Please continue. No, I don't that's I don't
00:31:52
entirely disagree. But as as I mentioned too that
00:31:57
you know, he did Goldeneye as well, which is perhaps more well
00:32:00
known for the video game adaptation.
00:32:02
This movie, which might be a first for the podcast, has a
00:32:05
video game adaptation. Funny, really.
00:32:09
Yeah, on the Super Nintendo. Super Nintendo.
00:32:12
OK, don't mind me, I'm just Googling Super Nintendo ROMs. I
00:32:17
was, so I haven't looked up any like footage or anything yet,
00:32:21
but I was like, no kidding. There's a No Escape video game
00:32:25
that's really interesting. Okay, we should we should put a
00:32:29
pin in that and we should, if we have time, take a look at the No
00:32:33
Escape video game, maybe for a future like update.
00:32:36
Yeah, right. Like I was like, I kind of want
00:32:38
to play that like. Of course I want to play that.
00:32:40
I wonder if Ray Leota does the voice work.
00:32:42
I love when they make film actors, like step into a trailer
00:32:46
for 30 minutes to do all the dialogue for the game adaptation
00:32:48
and they're just so sleepy. Like, what was it?
00:32:52
I think it was the Spider Man games with like Tobey Maguire,
00:32:55
Spider Man, If you play those, he delivers all his lines.
00:32:57
Like he's just like half asleep. Is it actually Toby doing the
00:33:01
lines? Yeah, they brought them in
00:33:03
probably while they were filming for whatever the movie was.
00:33:05
And then he's just like, I'll get you, Goblin.
00:33:09
Well, it's funny to bring that up too, because like again, I
00:33:11
was looking up Ray Liotta. I was like, so other than
00:33:13
Goodfellas this man has done other roles I assume.
00:33:17
Probably. Probably not just Goodfellas.
00:33:20
Yeah, yeah. But he's he's one of the the
00:33:23
main characters in one of the GTA games.
00:33:26
I want to say like San Andreas maybe.
00:33:30
Oh, he. Is.
00:33:31
I knew that actually, I'd just forgotten.
00:33:33
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm sure that that's come across
00:33:35
my desk at some point, but I just and also.
00:33:39
News from the front Ray Liotta is in Grand Theft Auto.
00:33:44
Yeah, back in 2002, yeah. Your desk was small because you
00:33:47
were like 14. But yeah, I was like, oh, that's
00:33:52
fun. So a lot of like unexpected
00:33:56
video game tie into this like. OK.
00:33:59
And if you look at the cover art of this film, it almost does
00:34:02
look like I'm like, I feel like you could just easily just take
00:34:05
that, put it on the box art of a video game and sell it based on
00:34:09
that alone. Because I doubt there was many
00:34:13
people that like, went and saw this film and then were
00:34:16
clamoring for like, wow, I can't wait till the game comes out,
00:34:18
obviously. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:34:20
It's more so it's always the afterthought of like, oh, I did
00:34:22
see that movie. I guess I'll play this nest
00:34:25
game. You know what I'm going to do?
00:34:27
I'm going to be, I'm going to give myself some work.
00:34:28
When I put out, when we put these out on YouTube, we have
00:34:31
the video version. I will try to splice in a couple
00:34:34
of quick screenshots from No Escape the video game just so
00:34:37
people can see what that's about, because I've not yet
00:34:39
looked at it, but I'm sure it's funny.
00:34:41
Yeah, yes, please do. We'll we'll both do some
00:34:44
independent research into. I'd love to actually play it
00:34:47
honestly. That would be like just really
00:34:49
fun. We'll start up our Meet Your
00:34:52
Double feature Twitch account and we'll play Noah.
00:34:56
Exclusively just that one. Just any other film that has a
00:34:59
video game adaptation, we'll just add that on there.
00:35:03
I wonder if any of them do like was there like a soldier game?
00:35:07
Not from what I saw, I mean I usually try and do some like
00:35:11
extra research after I watch the films and so I didn't see any
00:35:16
soldier video game tie insurance.
00:35:19
OK, good to know. I'm that is kind of a tangent,
00:35:22
kind of not because it's about to fill, but now I'm just
00:35:24
thinking about the game. No, yeah, it's super.
00:35:26
Interesting though. Yeah, I was just like, wow,
00:35:28
that's like I said, maybe a first for the pod.
00:35:30
I think it is. Possibly a first.
00:35:32
Unless Rushmore has a video game adaptation.
00:35:34
Rushmore. Has a video game.
00:35:36
A visual novel of some kind. The point and click Wes Anderson
00:35:40
game. OK so now the other to do for
00:35:44
editor me is to get the Twitch account Meet your double feature
00:35:47
before somebody snipes it. Sure.
00:35:49
Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's true.
00:35:51
That's true. We got to jump on that.
00:35:53
Got to get on that. OK cool.
00:35:54
OK, OK, to recap my understanding.
00:35:58
Some good performances for No Escape.
00:36:01
Maybe a disappointing lead performance from Ray Liotta.
00:36:03
Not really his fault, just not enough material.
00:36:06
Awesome sci-fi action. A video game adaptation.
00:36:10
Yes. Those are the the tenants so
00:36:13
far. Is there any other like area of
00:36:16
the filmmaking or or just the movies plotting that you want to
00:36:19
go through? What?
00:36:20
Well, one other thing that is for sure a first for the
00:36:23
podcast, maybe a first for me ever in a film that I've seen,
00:36:29
is this movie does not have a single woman in it in any
00:36:36
capacity at all like on screen. Wow.
00:36:40
That. Just zero.
00:36:44
And, and so from what I read when they were shopping the film
00:36:50
around to some of the major studios, that was the reason
00:36:55
that the film got shut down like this.
00:36:58
This this film was pitched to to some of the like, you know, to
00:37:02
to be a major kind of blockbuster release because
00:37:05
that's the type of film that it is.
00:37:08
But the studio heads or producers or whoever was in
00:37:12
charge of making this decisions was like, there's no women in
00:37:15
the film at all, period. Like, so they're like, they
00:37:18
passed on it because of that. Yeah.
00:37:21
And so it forced them to go with in independent film production
00:37:26
company that had only done like two other films up until that
00:37:29
point. It was called Savoy Pictures.
00:37:33
Interesting that yeah, I can't think of an example.
00:37:37
I understand that there are stories that are about groups of
00:37:40
men for very specific reasons, but to not even have like I'm
00:37:44
picturing like flashbacks to Ray Leona's wife on a beach and then
00:37:47
under a bed sheet or something. You know, just the usual imagery
00:37:51
for like, dead wife, yes. Or or like running along the
00:37:55
beach with some kind of like scarf or something flowing.
00:37:57
Behind yeah, like a big flowy dress and then they're just
00:38:00
like, but can you tell me anything about your wife?
00:38:02
And then he's like the dress and the hair.
00:38:04
It's like but what what she like?
00:38:06
And she smelled like seagulls smell.
00:38:10
Like. Wait, what?
00:38:15
Took a minute to register? OK, I, I just really, I just
00:38:20
thought about that now that that's how men in movies like
00:38:23
think about their dead wives is not anything they said.
00:38:26
Usually these scenes are muted. It's just like, ah, she was
00:38:28
talking about something, but she she was on the beach.
00:38:33
Yeah, none of that. Nothing like.
00:38:35
And it's like there was an opportunity too.
00:38:38
Like there's like, because while they're on the island, it's sort
00:38:41
of cutting back and forth at times between this like control
00:38:45
room where like the warden of the prison is like monitoring
00:38:47
them and there's people working there in that control room.
00:38:51
And I'm like, there was a an opportunity for even an extra in
00:38:55
this scene to be a woman, but Nope, it is.
00:38:57
All None. Yeah.
00:38:59
Yeah. Have we looked at the crew?
00:39:00
Were there any women in the crew?
00:39:02
I would I would assume as much. But it wasn't just a mandate,
00:39:06
no. Yeah, in terms of all a mandate,
00:39:09
yeah, it was definitely mandate. It was all men.
00:39:11
But in terms of like. Dates.
00:39:14
That's why there's no. Way.
00:39:16
Yeah, exactly. In terms of on screen
00:39:18
characters, no. Which, wow, yeah.
00:39:21
I was like, man, maybe, like maybe there's some obscure art
00:39:25
film I've seen that that had the only men in it, but this might
00:39:29
be the first movie I've ever seen in terms of a feature
00:39:31
length film that was strictly all men.
00:39:34
Now I get why you called Massachusetts a she You were
00:39:36
just trying to get some inclusion.
00:39:38
Yes, yes, exactly. I was like, no, no, there's too,
00:39:43
too much testosterone in here. Yeah, can a movie fail the
00:39:46
Bechdel test if there's no women in in the first place?
00:39:49
Wow. Oh, wait.
00:39:51
No, Yeah, yeah. Because that's the first part.
00:39:53
That's the part they usually get, because that's the what is
00:39:56
it? It's you pass the Bechdel test
00:39:57
if there's more than one woman in the story, which no escape
00:40:02
has already failed. And then it's supposed to be, do
00:40:04
the women talk to each other? And do they talk about something
00:40:07
other than a man or a relationship?
00:40:09
And no escape was like, well, we're not going to clear those
00:40:11
other two hurdles, so let's just skip this first.
00:40:13
One just completely bypass the whole conversation.
00:40:16
What? That's weird.
00:40:17
I I again, I get it's based on a book.
00:40:20
I can't imagine the author was like, if I see a woman in this
00:40:24
movie, you're getting your, you know, IP rights revoked.
00:40:27
It just seems. Weird.
00:40:29
What? I mean, it was enough of a
00:40:31
sticking point that like, the studios rejected the film.
00:40:33
And I can't say I blame them at all because it's noticeable.
00:40:36
Like very early on. It's like, wow, this is just all
00:40:40
dudes, like just nothing. But I'm like, I get that it's.
00:40:46
That's not even good from an advertising perspective.
00:40:48
I'm thinking of the movie cynical, cynical version of like
00:40:52
a studio executive who would probably look at this movie
00:40:55
that's marketed towards a male audience because it's like
00:40:57
sci-fi action and would probably be like, well, we need like a
00:41:00
woman to put on the cover. And then they'll go see, you
00:41:04
know, that's like the most base marketing for a movie like this.
00:41:07
And they said, no, we're in it for the craft.
00:41:11
We're not in it for cheap, cheap advertising purposes.
00:41:15
This is about dudes going to jail.
00:41:17
This is about man dates. OK Man dates on the 1st, 1st
00:41:22
Manosphere film 1994. Just it was.
00:41:27
Really. Like, yeah, I don't know.
00:41:30
It was, it was kind of shocking, honestly, like.
00:41:34
Even we've done better than that.
00:41:36
My wife does our introductions at the beginning of our
00:41:38
episodes. This is a two person show and
00:41:40
we've had a woman on it. Yes, yeah.
00:41:46
I was just like, I was like, wow.
00:41:49
Like, like nothing like I was expecting at some point because,
00:41:54
you know, again, it's like, like you were saying, it's it's that
00:41:57
action movie formula. Even even if you're being very,
00:42:01
like, cynical about it, it's just like, yeah, like, you would
00:42:05
have thought they would have maybe tried to adapt the story
00:42:09
in some way to include at least one woman in the film.
00:42:12
But. Yeah, no, it feels like a
00:42:15
reflection on the original author.
00:42:16
Now I want to see what was going on with them.
00:42:18
I mean, it's like, I guess, but they're like, they're like no
00:42:23
prison. No, it's all dudes prison.
00:42:25
Science fiction Future prison islands can't have women.
00:42:29
But hey, you know, like I said, we don't know what this world
00:42:32
is. Maybe there is no women in this.
00:42:33
Maybe there's no universe. That's a good point.
00:42:36
Like the year is 2022. Women have collectively had
00:42:39
enough and have gone away. They.
00:42:44
Just. They're like, Nope, can't.
00:42:46
Yeah, I'm done with this. Yeah, we got not interested.
00:42:51
OK, that's crazy. What a huh?
00:42:56
Right. Isn't that, isn't that
00:42:58
something? No escape.
00:42:59
No escape from all the men that you have to talk to non-stop.
00:43:02
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. OK, that's no escape, not what I
00:43:07
expected. I feel like I think that every
00:43:09
time we talk about one of these, I think that's not what I
00:43:11
expected, and this is no exception.
00:43:13
Hey, you know what? That's one of the advantages of
00:43:16
the show I. Guess yeah.
00:43:18
OK. Any any closing thoughts on no
00:43:22
escape? I'll just say like, it was an
00:43:26
interesting film because it was a film of firsts in some ways,
00:43:29
you know, like, yeah, it, it had a uniqueness to it and I didn't
00:43:36
hate watching it, but I didn't love it so.
00:43:39
Yeah, yeah, that doesn't bode well for scoring later on.
00:43:46
OK, well, I'm I'm you've stunlocked me with this, with
00:43:50
this series of descriptions about more escape I can't even
00:43:53
think of. I can't even think about a
00:43:55
transition. How do you encapsulate this?
00:43:57
Yeah. Yeah, anyway, we're going to go
00:44:00
to our intermission now anyway. Yeah, just a big old.
00:44:04
Anyway, we're going to go into our intermission now, and when
00:44:06
we return, I'll be talking about a movie that I promise has at
00:44:10
least one woman in it. Stay tuned for Rushmore,
00:44:12
everybody. OK, coming back now on the other
00:44:25
side of the break, Frank, it is time for me to talk about the
00:44:27
film you asked me to watch, 1990 Eights Rushmore.
00:44:31
Do you recall why you asked me to watch Rushmore?
00:44:34
Yeah, well, I mean, I I was just saying this off air, but this
00:44:37
this felt like A to me, it's felt like a slam dunk, you know,
00:44:41
like early Wes Anderson, like kind of establishing his style
00:44:47
or maybe prior to him finding his kind of filmic voice and the
00:44:51
cast as well. I mean, just like, is Bill
00:44:55
Murray, I believe is, is in this one, Bill Murray and Owen
00:44:59
Wilson, like just seemed hard to go wrong with this.
00:45:02
So I'm curious to see what you actually thought of it.
00:45:06
Yeah, yeah, it was. It was interesting for me for
00:45:08
that same reason. I have seen not all of Wes
00:45:12
Anderson's movies but some. I know you and I both really
00:45:14
like Grand Budapest Hotel, which he made much later.
00:45:19
My wife adores Fantastic Mr. Fox, that's like one of her
00:45:22
favorite movies. So I definitely have stuff in
00:45:24
his catalog that I'm really familiar with.
00:45:25
But I've never seen anything he made like before 2000.
00:45:28
And for this one, I think it's his second film that he
00:45:32
directed, second like main effort.
00:45:35
And actually he brought up Owen Wilson.
00:45:37
He is not in the movie but he Co wrote the screenplay.
00:45:39
Oh OK, I just saw his name attached to it so I just.
00:45:42
Assumed he was a part of it. The Wilson brothers, Luke, Luke
00:45:46
and Owen Wilson, were like collaborators with Wes Anderson
00:45:48
from the beginning. And we do get a very small role
00:45:51
from Luke Wilson in this one. But I guess, yeah, they weren't
00:45:54
always in them. What's that?
00:45:55
I started just, I was like, I like Luke Wilson.
00:45:57
I feel like he's like underappreciated, especially
00:46:00
compared to his brother. But like, he's usually great,
00:46:03
especially when he shows up in like these types of movies.
00:46:05
Yeah, for some reason I thought you said how old is Luke Wilson?
00:46:07
Like that was just like your name.
00:46:08
Live interrogation. How old is that guy now, 40?
00:46:12
Tell me that right now. 42 Can we stop?
00:46:14
Can we look up how old Luke Wilson is?
00:46:18
Great. He does not have a lot to do
00:46:19
here. The main cast is Jason
00:46:22
Schwartzman, who is another Wes Anderson collaborator.
00:46:26
But it's really he's really young.
00:46:27
I don't know if this is like his first feature, but he's like
00:46:29
1718 when this movie was made. And then Bill Murray is one of
00:46:32
the other leads. And then, oh gosh, I'm
00:46:34
forgetting the name of the third lead.
00:46:37
Let me look that up really quick before I forget.
00:46:38
Should. I just guess in the meantime.
00:46:41
We can guess it's a it's a woman.
00:46:43
So we've passed the rush, the no escape test.
00:46:47
Is there a woman anywhere in the movie?
00:46:49
Is it Oprah Winfrey? Oprah Winfrey?
00:46:53
Is that what you said? Yeah.
00:46:55
Is not Oprah Winfrey. Not Owen Wilson again either,
00:46:58
but it is Olivia Williams. So you had the initials, right?
00:47:01
Oh cool all. Right, which I mean really,
00:47:03
that's pretty good. That's pretty good.
00:47:05
I was getting like a psychic message there, you know?
00:47:07
Yeah, you were doing like a hot read.
00:47:09
You were like, I'm I'm sensing Oprah, Oprah, Olivia.
00:47:12
And then they're like Olivia and you're like, yeah, that's
00:47:14
exactly right. Anyway, yes, Olivia Williams,
00:47:19
she's like the other lead. I don't know her from anything.
00:47:22
She's done a lot of like British film and TV, it looks like.
00:47:25
So that's your main cast. It's not really like a huge
00:47:27
ensemble like a lot of later Wes Anderson movies, but it is just
00:47:31
nice to see Bill Murray in a starring role.
00:47:33
I'm a big fan of his, like most people, but I just don't.
00:47:36
I don't think I've seen any of the Wes Anderson movies he's
00:47:38
been in before this one. Yeah, right.
00:47:41
I think I've seen Life Aquatic, maybe one other one.
00:47:44
But yeah, I mean, he he usually appears in like like he's not
00:47:47
always like one of the main. Characters.
00:47:49
Yes, it seems from my brief review looking at it, he seemed
00:47:54
to be like a frequent collaborator in the first half
00:47:56
of Wes Anderson's career and then has appeared more
00:47:59
sporadically since then. But he's definitely like
00:48:02
probably the, you know, second or third lead in this one.
00:48:06
So that part is interesting. This does, to your point, feel
00:48:09
like a not yet formed Wes Anderson in terms of style.
00:48:13
And that's a lot of what I like about it.
00:48:15
I think that his more recent works, a lot of which have
00:48:18
gotten very like middle of the road reviews to some extent
00:48:21
because it's just more of what you've seen.
00:48:23
And I think his style has become so specific and so one note in a
00:48:28
way that it's both very creative and very familiar, which makes
00:48:32
it less interesting. Whereas Rushmore, it feels
00:48:35
primarily like it takes place in a real space.
00:48:38
Does that make sense? Yes, but elaborate on that.
00:48:41
So like newer Wes Anderson production design, I would say
00:48:44
anything from like the 20 tens onward for him is done in a way
00:48:49
that's very intentionally A facade.
00:48:51
A lot of the sets look like paper thin walls.
00:48:54
It looks like there's no ceiling.
00:48:56
It's designed to either resemble a stage play or like a pop up
00:49:01
storybook or something. And that's not because he
00:49:03
doesn't know what he's doing. It's it's an intentional effort
00:49:06
to create a sense of like surrealness in those stories.
00:49:10
I also think that the character dialogue is very distinct in Wes
00:49:13
Anderson movies. They all talk in this sort of
00:49:15
unrealistic way that's kind of stilted and verbose at the same
00:49:19
time, which Rushmore smartly only does for its main
00:49:24
character, Jason Schwartzman in It talks like a Wes Anderson
00:49:27
movie character, and nobody else does, which is quite nice.
00:49:31
Oh, sure. Yeah, that's that sounds very
00:49:33
refreshing actually. Yeah, it's weird to go backwards
00:49:36
to find the kind of reinvention, because I've seen his work, but
00:49:40
it's so hard for me to place what this movie must have felt
00:49:43
like in a world that did not previously have Wes Anderson in
00:49:46
it, you know? Yeah, Yeah, that was well put
00:49:49
too actually, because I, I feel like to to that point too, that
00:49:52
feeling like a like a real world like as opposed to a sort of
00:49:58
visual production like what we might have touched on that a
00:50:01
little bit when we were talking about Tim Burton last week,
00:50:04
because I feel like that's a he has a very similar.
00:50:07
That's right. Stylistic choices in a very
00:50:10
different way than Wes Anderson, but it it kind of like sort of
00:50:14
leads to a similar result. They're very, I think if I'm, if
00:50:18
my film school memory is returning to me, I think you
00:50:21
would call them both expressionistic because they
00:50:23
focus a lot on reminding you of the space.
00:50:27
There's a lot of geometry and attention being drawn to the
00:50:30
facade of the film in the filmmaking, whereas by contrast,
00:50:34
something more. What's the opposite of
00:50:37
expressionistic? Impressionistic looks like
00:50:40
internalistic. That's not it.
00:50:44
The one that's like inside your head, you know, that focuses
00:50:47
more on like if that's like French New Wave stuff, you know,
00:50:51
things that are very much about breaking film form and rhythm
00:50:53
and it's all about close-ups and emotion.
00:50:55
Expressionist to filmmaking is that kind of intentional
00:50:58
distance, which I think a lot of people would observe in Wes
00:51:01
Anderson's work because of how the people talk like they are
00:51:04
cold in a way. And again, I think that is still
00:51:07
here in Rushmore, but it's blended into a more traditional
00:51:12
piece of filmmaking and I really like that element about it.
00:51:15
Yeah, that sounds great that that was kind of what I was
00:51:17
hoping for. I might may have not articulated
00:51:20
it exactly that way, but like that's was my intention with
00:51:25
trying to recommend something early in his career like that.
00:51:27
Or I guess more so my hope because I haven't seen a lot of
00:51:30
those films either, so. Yeah, it's fun.
00:51:32
It's definitely an interesting. I can imagine going to the
00:51:36
movies in the 90s and seeing these early Wes Anderson films
00:51:39
and being like, wow, they just have really great
00:51:41
cinematography. There's such a fun quality to
00:51:43
this when it's like a novel thing.
00:51:46
I guess to just explain like the base premise for Rushmore, it
00:51:49
takes place at some sort of like fancy prep Academy that's for
00:51:54
like elementary through high school, it looks like.
00:51:58
And your main character, played by young Jason Schwartzman, is a
00:52:01
15 year old student named Max Something God.
00:52:06
What is it with the names today? Max?
00:52:08
Headroom. Max Headroom.
00:52:11
What is this man's name? Max Whatever.
00:52:19
HBO Max. HBO Max is a student at the
00:52:23
Academy, which is called Rushmore, and the think they
00:52:27
communicate to you right off the bat is that he is deeply
00:52:30
involved in activities at the school.
00:52:31
There is a montage early on that shows that he has founded like
00:52:35
two dozen clubs and is the president of everything,
00:52:37
including these super like niche and esoteric things.
00:52:41
He's like head of the debate team.
00:52:42
He leads the beekeeping club. Just anything you can think of
00:52:45
he's doing, which is supposed to create this impression that he's
00:52:49
like some sort of Uber genius or something.
00:52:51
But right away, after being introduced to this information,
00:52:54
you hear from, like, the headmaster of the school, and
00:52:57
they're just like, yeah, Max is kind of an idiot, really.
00:53:01
Like, he's doing really poorly in school.
00:53:04
He's at risk of being expelled for bad grades.
00:53:07
Oh, I see, because he's so involved in these
00:53:09
extracurriculars. Well, that's what's interesting.
00:53:11
When the movie starts, we we open on a goodwill hunting esque
00:53:17
dream sequence where he's in the back of a class and there's like
00:53:19
a math equation on the wall that the teacher says no one's ever
00:53:22
solved. And they're like, man, if
00:53:23
anybody can figure this out, no homework for the rest of the
00:53:26
year. And then he like, struts up and
00:53:27
like solves it. But then you realize he's
00:53:29
dreaming. And I thought I was like, oh, it
00:53:31
is just that he could be doing better, but he's not applying
00:53:35
himself because he's too distracted or there's an
00:53:38
impression that he just wants to stay at this school forever,
00:53:41
which is true. It's like his comfort zone, but
00:53:43
the movie never directly says that.
00:53:46
This isn't partially that he's just not doing well.
00:53:48
Like I think he isn't trying hard enough, but it's not like
00:53:51
if he tried it'd be easy. He inherently is just not smart
00:53:54
enough to do great. Well, I mean, that's an
00:53:57
interesting character flaw for, you know, the film.
00:54:00
It is because he carries himself.
00:54:03
He. He's basically like a little
00:54:04
teenage boy trying to carry himself like an adult who's
00:54:07
bigger and older than he is. He walks around, he's got his
00:54:10
fancy blazer on at all times. He is in charge of everything,
00:54:13
and he's always trying to communicate to other adults in
00:54:15
the story as if he also is 1, which is where a lot of the
00:54:17
comedy is supposed to come from. And so that's like your big
00:54:22
introduction to Max is like, he's not doing great, but also
00:54:25
he's kind of doing great because he's so well known and like does
00:54:28
so much around here. But he has a couple of early
00:54:32
interactions with Bill Murray's character, who is essentially an
00:54:35
alumnus from the school that I'm trying to think how to easily
00:54:38
summarize Bill Murray's character.
00:54:39
He's essentially a successful rich alumnus who's like, down on
00:54:44
his luck in different ways where his sons go to the school, but
00:54:47
he like does has no relationship with them because they're both
00:54:49
just like jocks. And he doesn't like, he wanted
00:54:52
smart kids essentially. And so he ends up bonding with
00:54:55
Max as like, you're kind of who I wish my kids were like.
00:54:59
Oh, OK. And their relationship is
00:55:01
bizarre because the whole movie is filled with these age gap
00:55:05
friendships. Where Max's two friends at the
00:55:09
beginning of the story are this younger kid, there's like
00:55:12
elementary age kid who follows them around and it's like his
00:55:14
assistant and then Bill Murray, who's like much older than him.
00:55:17
And yet they speak to each other with no like authority tone
00:55:21
behind it. It's they just kind of talk like
00:55:23
they're friends the whole time and then they turn into like
00:55:25
romantic rivals as the story goes on.
00:55:27
It's very. Romantic rivals?
00:55:29
Whoa. Yeah, because I'm trying to
00:55:32
remember off him. I watched this movie late last
00:55:34
night, so forgive me, but there's a couple of beats early
00:55:36
on. Where Max has a great line that
00:55:39
kind of sums up his like perspective when the movie opens
00:55:43
where he says, and this is a quote actually, I think you just
00:55:46
got to find something you love to do and do it for the rest of
00:55:49
your life. For me, that's going to rush
00:55:51
more. So that's his like headspace at
00:55:53
the beginning. But after being threatened with
00:55:55
expulsion for not doing well enough with his actual
00:55:57
coursework, he tries to like, reevaluate his approach and
00:56:02
rather than take the obvious out of just stop doing so many clubs
00:56:05
and activities, he for some reason decides his problem is
00:56:08
that he's not focused enough on getting girls.
00:56:12
OK. That's kind of a pivot.
00:56:14
He essentially, in order to avoid confronting the real
00:56:16
problem, just decides that it's, you know, he's like, that's what
00:56:19
I see all the other guys here doing and they're all doing
00:56:21
fine. Nobody's threatening to expel
00:56:23
them. And he ends up coming across a
00:56:25
quote like written in the margins of a book at the school
00:56:28
library, like some kind of Half Blood Prince thing.
00:56:31
And he finds out that the person who wrote it was this young
00:56:34
teacher at the school. And so the real crux of the
00:56:37
movie, from a certain point onward, is that Max has fallen
00:56:39
in love with this adult woman who teaches at Rushmore.
00:56:42
Like he actually fell in love with her or he just sort of like
00:56:47
decided like, I'm in love with this person now.
00:56:50
You just figured out the whole plot of the movie before he did?
00:56:52
Yeah, that's what happened. He fell in love with the idea of
00:56:55
a relationship and a woman that he barely knows and spends the
00:56:59
entire film trying to win her over while also having some side
00:57:03
plots that involve the other characters.
00:57:06
And I got to say, this is where the movie moves into more muddy
00:57:10
territory for how much I liked it, because everything that's
00:57:13
happening here is done with a lot of intention.
00:57:15
The movie frames Max's efforts to, like, doggedly pursue this
00:57:18
woman as stupid and wrong because he's 15, as they keep
00:57:23
saying. But I think you're also supposed
00:57:27
to, from the film maker's perspective, find his efforts
00:57:30
kind of charming because it's silly.
00:57:34
Like, he's constantly coming up with these schemes to get alone
00:57:37
with this woman and profess that he wants to be with her.
00:57:39
But then he'll backtrack when she, like, pushes him away, only
00:57:41
to try again later. It culminates later in the movie
00:57:44
with him, like, faking an injury outside of her house so that
00:57:47
she'll let him inside. And then he tries to, like, kiss
00:57:48
her on the mouth. And she has to be like, get out
00:57:50
of here. So it writes this line the whole
00:57:54
time of being like awkward and uncomfortable versus like silly.
00:57:59
And I do think that for the time it's supposed to mostly land on
00:58:03
like Max is misguided. But it is hard now not to watch
00:58:05
this and be like Max is a creep. Yeah, I can.
00:58:09
I can see that. But it also doesn't sound like
00:58:11
you're supposed to be like, like you said, you're maybe supposed
00:58:13
to find his antics charming, but you're probably not supposed to
00:58:17
be, like, rooting for him to succeed in these.
00:58:21
Like no. That's correct, You're supposed
00:58:24
to be rooting for him to figure things out and leave this woman
00:58:27
alone. But the way it's portrayed, this
00:58:30
comes up a lot with filmmaking where you want something to be
00:58:34
more visual, so you add an action to it that immediately
00:58:36
crosses the line if it actually happened in real life.
00:58:38
Like, there's one thing with him professing his love for this
00:58:41
woman and trying to make her date him, but at one point
00:58:44
towards the middle, he literally is trying to like, force himself
00:58:47
on her. He's like grabbing her by the
00:58:48
shoulders and trying to like, kiss her mouth and just like,
00:58:50
shove him away. And it's like, I understand that
00:58:53
that's more visual and maybe gets the idea across, but that's
00:58:56
like such an escalation of like a small kind of violence in a
00:59:00
way where it's like, that's not funny, you know?
00:59:03
It's, it's just like, it's one of those things where I'm sure
00:59:05
you could recut the trailer for this movie.
00:59:07
It's like a horror film. Yeah, I mean, it sounds like
00:59:12
he's obsessive enough that you could perceive it that way, that
00:59:17
he's relentlessly pursuing her. It would be funnier, like they
00:59:20
try to play this angle where she is so clear and firm.
00:59:24
She's not like oblivious. She gets ahead of it
00:59:25
immediately. She's like, Max, I feel like
00:59:27
you're trying to form a relationship here and obviously
00:59:30
that's not going to happen. I need you to stop.
00:59:32
And he always kind of plays it like, like, he misunderstands or
00:59:35
isn't quite sure what she's getting AT.
00:59:36
And then he just keeps trying, which can work if you do it in a
00:59:40
very specific way. But I do think that at times in
00:59:42
this one, I was just like, ah, we've leaned too far.
00:59:45
We've leaned too far. And it makes Max less pitiful
00:59:48
and more just aggressively creepy.
00:59:51
So I don't know. I think that's a really like,
00:59:53
that might vary person to person watching the movie.
00:59:56
Some people might just take it more for what it's clearly
00:59:57
trying to be, which is not a realistic situation at all.
01:00:01
But. If you're sensitive to that kind
01:00:03
of thing, you know, like I'm picturing somebody watching this
01:00:05
movie who's maybe been like relentlessly pursued by some man
01:00:09
in a very uncomfortable way. And I don't think anything about
01:00:11
this would read as funny to that person, you know?
01:00:14
Yeah, yeah, of course. Yeah.
01:00:16
But it almost, I guess having not seen it, I'm not sure that
01:00:21
was perhaps the actual in intention that like you're
01:00:25
supposed to be uncomfortable like with him and his character
01:00:29
this way. You're supposed to be in at
01:00:32
times and in specific ways. But again, if you want the movie
01:00:35
to still read as kind of like quirky and funny overall, you
01:00:38
have to be very mindful of how you try to make that story land.
01:00:42
And it's so there's so many instances of him pursuing this
01:00:46
woman and it gets so like, weird at a few points that it just
01:00:50
like, for me, felt like it tipped over the edge of what it
01:00:53
was. It was like a tightrope act
01:00:55
tonally. And they kind of fell off
01:00:56
towards the end. Is it all mostly towards the end
01:00:59
or is it just like because I guess how much of the film is
01:01:03
him pursuing this woman? I mean, most of it, I'm trying
01:01:06
to think of the overall rhythm here.
01:01:08
So he gets obsessed with this woman.
01:01:11
He ends up going around because she's a teacher at the school
01:01:13
and they do have like a friendship because in her words,
01:01:17
she's like a young woman. But she already had her husband
01:01:19
pass away from some sudden thing.
01:01:21
And she talks about how Max kind of reminds him of a younger
01:01:24
version of her husband. And then so they spend a lot of
01:01:27
that movie together. But then because Max is also
01:01:30
friends with Bill Murray's character, he just ends up
01:01:32
getting roped along at times like, and it feels like he, the
01:01:35
kid is taking these two adults out to do activities in a way
01:01:38
where you're just like, why would when would this ever
01:01:40
happen? Like, it's that's the heightened
01:01:42
realism of the whole thing. But as far as plotting, Bill
01:01:45
Murray also eventually falls in love with the same woman, which
01:01:48
is why again, they become romantic rifles by the time like
01:01:50
the second act starts. Yeah, it's interesting,
01:01:53
especially because, like, from HBO Max's perspective, it's a
01:01:59
like, it's a adolescent, like misinformed type of attraction
01:02:06
that he's confusing. And it almost sounds like, you
01:02:11
know, he just set a goal for himself to find romantic
01:02:15
partnership and just like, latched on to this first person
01:02:18
that, you know, he decided. Would.
01:02:22
Fulfill that for him because the character is very young, like I
01:02:25
was. I was actually surprised when he
01:02:26
said that at the beginning that he's 15, that that's that's a
01:02:29
very, very young POV character. Which is probably also supposed
01:02:33
to soften the whole thing because he is very short and
01:02:37
small and like not there's nothing physically intimidating
01:02:40
the the woman is like much bigger than him.
01:02:43
Yeah, yeah, for sure. So I mean, if I mean, if it was
01:02:47
off putting to you, it's off putting.
01:02:49
That's just. Yeah, I don't know.
01:02:52
I can't. I can't thinking about that
01:02:54
after I was done watching it, I was like, I don't know.
01:02:56
I, I understand there's a lot of stories about this, this kind of
01:02:59
like you said, it's like an adolescent thing of a young boy
01:03:02
trying to fill the role of what he thinks a man is.
01:03:05
And in his mind, for Max, it was like pursuing this woman and
01:03:07
having a relationship, even though we all know he doesn't
01:03:09
know what that means. Like, there's a a scene where
01:03:13
the woman Miss Crossed, as they call her throughout most of the
01:03:16
film, she gets so fed up with it.
01:03:18
And she's just like, Max, what do you think is supposed to
01:03:19
happen? She's like, do you think we're
01:03:20
going to have sex? You don't know what that is.
01:03:22
You don't know what you're doing.
01:03:23
Like, it's a very, like, pointed takedown that he's just
01:03:26
fantasizing and it's ultimately fruitless.
01:03:29
And in the meantime, he's bothering a lot of people.
01:03:32
Sure. Because I, I feel like it's
01:03:34
similar to the scene you described at the beginning, the
01:03:36
Goodwill hunting scene where he just has it like this dream, you
01:03:40
know, that he, he's just going to, with no knowledge or
01:03:43
preparation, he's just going to walk up and, and do things
01:03:46
perfectly. Exactly.
01:03:48
So again, all of this is intentional.
01:03:50
It's not a case of the writing and directing trying to achieve
01:03:54
a goal and not hitting it. It's just about whether that
01:03:57
makes the movie approachable for like a wider audience.
01:04:01
Like this movie feels like it's so much about a young man's
01:04:03
experience. And while it's not no escape,
01:04:05
there are women in the story. I, I don't, it doesn't feel
01:04:09
catered towards like a web, it's perspective at all, which is
01:04:13
totally fine. Not everything needs to be both,
01:04:15
but we're all, you know, gender perspectives.
01:04:18
But it is narrow, like Rushmore has a very narrow view because
01:04:22
of what it's choosing to focus on.
01:04:24
And I found that element interesting.
01:04:25
Sure. Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
01:04:27
And I don't know how much of Wes Anderson's, the rest of his
01:04:30
filmography focuses on similar ideas.
01:04:33
Or, you know, given that this was one of his earlier, because
01:04:36
he wrote this film as well, right?
01:04:37
Him and Owen Wilson, yes. Simon O Wilson, Co wrote it.
01:04:39
I think he's written probably almost everything he's directed.
01:04:42
Yeah. So I would have to assume some
01:04:44
of this comes from first hand experience on.
01:04:46
On I think so I think it is a reflection of some sort of lived
01:04:50
experience. The thing that I'm not haven't
01:04:54
gotten to yet is that obviously this movie is a comedy.
01:04:56
It's a very dry comedy in the way that a lot of Wes Anderson's
01:04:59
movies are. And I I don't think there's
01:05:02
really anything in the movie that gets a huge laugh because
01:05:04
it's not trying for that. It feels like a predecessor to
01:05:08
that kind of late 2000s like indie comedy drama that you've
01:05:12
seen 1000 of where it's like all amusing in a way, but it's not
01:05:16
really trying to like, make you, you know?
01:05:18
Guffaw. Yeah, there's no guffawing here.
01:05:21
There's, there's like breathing through the nose kind of laughs.
01:05:25
Yeah, it's a, it's a humorous environment, not like.
01:05:29
You know it's a hike. Realism.
01:05:31
It's not, yeah, there's not really like heavy punch lines.
01:05:34
There's like silly qualities to the whole thing.
01:05:36
But I do think that, again, it's hard to evaluate this
01:05:40
retroactively. You know how people talk about
01:05:43
like, there's a phenomenon where some people think the sitcom
01:05:46
Seinfeld isn't funny because they've seen 20 plus years since
01:05:50
of things influenced by what it invented.
01:05:53
And so when you go back to the source, it's like not as
01:05:55
interesting. I couldn't have disagreed more,
01:05:57
but this one? No, no, no.
01:05:59
We don't think Seinfeld isn't funny, but that's like a named
01:06:02
thing. Like once you've seen the later
01:06:04
influences, if you go back to the source, it doesn't feel
01:06:07
novel, so it doesn't feel interesting, even though you
01:06:10
have to remember it's like before this there was nothing
01:06:12
like this. And I think having seen a lot of
01:06:15
later Wes Anderson movies, that's a quality about Rushmore.
01:06:17
It's like the comedy and the comedic styling of the whole
01:06:21
thing isn't making me laugh because I've seen it a lot.
01:06:24
Whereas if you'd never seen anything like this, I think you
01:06:26
would find like rhythm of the editing and the shot
01:06:29
compositions to be like inherently funny just because
01:06:31
it's a bit unique. But the uniqueness has worn off
01:06:34
for me because I've seen like 7 of this guy's movies.
01:06:36
Sure, sure. Do you like generally speaking
01:06:40
those types of films though? Like like the ones you describe
01:06:42
or compared it to the the sort of quirky late 2000s like indie
01:06:48
comedy dramas. I find those all to be a coin
01:06:50
flip, you know what I mean? Like I, I can't say I
01:06:54
universally like or dislike them.
01:06:55
Even among Wes Anderson's filmography, I think I really
01:06:58
liked a couple and felt nothing towards the rest.
01:07:01
So it's a type of comedy that has to like find a very narrow
01:07:05
thread to like tickle you. And then if that works, you're
01:07:08
going to like the movie quite a bit.
01:07:10
But if you don't ever like find that way in, you're just kind of
01:07:12
watching like, OK, OK. And it's it's done.
01:07:16
Yeah, especially because it's especially this one, it's, it's
01:07:19
like a, it's like an uncomfortable type of humor.
01:07:23
You know, it's, it's, it's like a type of humor where it's like
01:07:26
you, you're almost, you laugh because you don't, you're so
01:07:30
uncomfortable. You don't know what else to do
01:07:31
in some situations. Yeah, there's a there's a cringe
01:07:34
comedy element here for sure. Like I'm trying to think of a
01:07:36
representative sequence. So one of Max's big things is
01:07:40
that he's like a play. He directs plays.
01:07:42
That's like one of his main callings amongst all of the
01:07:44
clubs and things he participates in.
01:07:46
And there's a silly bit at the beginning where even though this
01:07:48
is like a school full of mostly young children, they're putting
01:07:51
on like, a stage play rendition of Serpico, the Al Pacino movie.
01:07:55
So it's them talking about like, gangsters and guns and stuff.
01:07:58
Like, it's all intentionally ridiculous.
01:08:01
And then as it goes, like towards the end of the movie, he
01:08:04
puts on a big play that just looks like Platoon.
01:08:06
It's like a Vietnam War thing. So these bits are very silly.
01:08:10
But he has an interaction where he invites this teacher, lady
01:08:13
Miss Cross to the play and then she brings Luke Wilson along who
01:08:17
she's clearly like seeing. And they had this dinner plan
01:08:20
for afterwards. So then we cut to the Super
01:08:22
awkward dinner that's like Max and Bill Murray and the teacher
01:08:25
and Luke Wilson. And Max is like, again, he's 15,
01:08:28
he's tiny as heck. He's trying to like essentially
01:08:30
out alpha Luke Wilson. Throughout this whole
01:08:32
conversation he keeps like acting like he doesn't remember
01:08:34
his name. Like they say it like 6 times
01:08:36
and he's just like what? What's his name again?
01:08:38
I don't recall. That's funny.
01:08:39
That made me laugh. It's funny on paper, but the
01:08:43
scenes not really that funny. Like, the rhythm of the scene is
01:08:46
not. It doesn't culminate in a big
01:08:48
laugh. It culminates in, like, an
01:08:50
awkward outburst because, again, the movie is making a point that
01:08:52
Max is like an emotional teenager where he ends up just
01:08:54
getting really mad and yelling at this teacher for being like
01:08:57
you. You know, you knew how I feel
01:09:00
after saying for the whole first act that he just wanted to be
01:09:02
friends. He's like, you knew I was in
01:09:03
love with you. Why did you bring this horrible
01:09:05
man here? That's like, yeah, maybe if
01:09:07
you're hearing these descriptions and you're like, I
01:09:08
love that kind of stuff. I love awkward, cringe teen
01:09:11
comedy. Go for it.
01:09:12
But everything I liked about Rushmore was more so like the
01:09:17
filmmaking. I I did not connect with the
01:09:21
script I guess very much. I can actually, I can understand
01:09:26
that, like, because I guess I would maybe feel similarly in
01:09:32
your situation because I, I also like generally speaking, like
01:09:36
the sort of coming of age comedy type stuff, comedy, drama, you
01:09:43
know, it either, I feel like it either hits when you're at a age
01:09:47
where you can relate to it directly, or you can like look
01:09:50
back on it and, and, and connect with it that way, like with your
01:09:53
own experiences. But I feel like that's a, it's
01:09:56
difficult to land that you know, and, and actually, and, and like
01:10:00
in a satisfying way. I can think of some great
01:10:03
examples. Like I, I love the movie
01:10:04
Superbad. I think Superbad.
01:10:06
Is Superbad, Yes, a lot of people love Superbad.
01:10:08
Yeah, that's a great example, again, of tackling the
01:10:12
awkwardness of being a child and having to deal with all these
01:10:15
like, rising adult emotions. But it makes genuinely funny.
01:10:21
It's not trying to be the same thing as much more, but it makes
01:10:23
a very memorable comedy out of that bit.
01:10:26
It heightens it in a way that makes it work as a movie for any
01:10:29
audience. Yeah, totally.
01:10:30
So it's not like a fair one to one comparison, but it they're
01:10:33
at least in the same ballpark, so to speak.
01:10:35
So it's like, yeah, it it's, you know, it's it's kind of just
01:10:38
interesting to see how you can approach that similar concept
01:10:42
and see one like that lands in such a big way for most people.
01:10:47
And then this one, which is kind of, I'm sure there are people
01:10:50
that love this movie. Yeah, absolutely.
01:10:53
It's, it's, I'm trying to give my reaction while also framing
01:10:57
how it might read to other people 'cause there are some
01:10:59
movies that are about coming of age stories that are probably
01:11:03
most impactful if you're coming of age still yourself.
01:11:06
But there's ones that I had not seen when I was a kid that I
01:11:09
still liked. I mean, the first movie you
01:11:10
asked me to watch for our show was Pump Up the Volume, which
01:11:14
was a coming of age like dark comedy drama.
01:11:18
Again, not even remotely trying to be the same thing as this
01:11:20
with Anderson movie. But it's not a movie I saw as a
01:11:23
teenager. But I still really liked it
01:11:26
because the I I just think as a piece of art and as a story, it
01:11:30
was like well put together and I could see how it would speak to
01:11:33
someone who was growing up around that time.
01:11:36
Rushmore is just feels like an incomplete draft of something
01:11:41
that Wes Anderson and Owen Wilson as writers got better at
01:11:45
later I think. Yeah, that's that's probably a
01:11:48
good way to put it because you know, that that's just kind of
01:11:50
the blind nature of these pics almost.
01:11:53
Because if I had known, I guess more So what this movie was, I
01:11:57
probably wouldn't have recommended it because it
01:11:58
doesn't sound like something I would have liked that much
01:12:01
either. Yeah, I'd be curious what I
01:12:03
think their first film, maybe I'm messing up this timeline,
01:12:06
but I believe their earliest film is called Bottle Rocket,
01:12:09
which is from 1996. I have no idea what that one's
01:12:11
about. I know that a lot of later Wes
01:12:13
Anderson movies are about a huge variety of things and usually
01:12:17
about an ensemble of characters. This one is much more focused.
01:12:20
It's primarily about Max. And then the other, probably
01:12:24
most critically acclaimed element of the story at the time
01:12:26
was Bill Murray's performance as a like a supporting actor.
01:12:29
Yeah, and like, obviously Bill Murray's great.
01:12:32
And like, it's really hard to miss with Bill Murray.
01:12:36
That is worth talking about though, because sorry you
01:12:38
finished your thought. Oh no, tell me more.
01:12:41
Did he did? Did we miss with Bill Murray?
01:12:43
We did not miss with Bill Murray, but this was again, part
01:12:46
of the struggle of reviewing this movie in retrospect because
01:12:49
I have seen the full scope of Bill Murray's career past 1998.
01:12:53
And I actually had to look up afterwards to get some context
01:12:57
for why this performance was celebrated at the time in the
01:13:00
way that it was because I think he got a Golden Globe nomination
01:13:03
and was just, it was a big movie.
01:13:05
There's a lot of trivia about how Bill Murray read this
01:13:07
screenplay and like, was desperate to be a part of it.
01:13:11
He loved it. He agreed to take almost no
01:13:13
salary to be in it. He ended up even using some of
01:13:15
his own money to like, finance elements of the production.
01:13:18
He was like a huge supporter of this film and in turn, became a
01:13:21
collaborator with Wes Anderson for years afterwards.
01:13:24
And I was like, why? You know, Like, I can't
01:13:27
immediately place what element there was, but you have to look
01:13:32
at it from where he was because Bill Murray's earliest successes
01:13:35
were all the same type of character.
01:13:37
It was like the guy in Ghostbusters, you know, he was
01:13:40
this, like, snarky, sarcastic, cynical comic figure.
01:13:45
And apparently he had been trying for a couple years at
01:13:47
this point in 98 to play a larger variety of roles and not
01:13:51
really had any big successes yet.
01:13:53
So this role for him in Rushmore was akin to watching, like Jim
01:13:56
Carrey and The Truman Show. It was taking a comic actor
01:13:59
known for one type of performance and seeing a very
01:14:03
different one that people really attached to.
01:14:04
It's like, wow, look at the range on Bill Murray.
01:14:07
Oh, sure. Yeah, totally that.
01:14:09
And that happens to a lot of like comedic actors where they
01:14:12
try and make that sort of dramatic turn.
01:14:15
It's also interesting that it sounds like he was sold
01:14:18
completely on the script, because it that kind of brings
01:14:21
up an interesting point. Like people talk about like how
01:14:24
a how a script reads basically, and it it's almost just like
01:14:29
what we just went through where you, like, you explained the
01:14:32
joke of that scene to me and it was funny in my head.
01:14:37
But then you like when you actually see it on screen, how
01:14:40
like you didn't find it that entertaining.
01:14:42
You know, it like it, it transforms when it's actually
01:14:45
like produced into a film because I can see like Bill
01:14:50
Murray, like reading this script and and like seeing the
01:14:53
dialogue, like you mentioned, where these like young
01:14:55
characters are speaking like adults and the thematic
01:14:59
elements, thematic thematic elephants.
01:15:03
What are what are thematic elephants, thematic elephants,
01:15:07
thematic elements of the film and like, you know, resonating
01:15:13
with that. So it's so it's interesting, you
01:15:14
know, that Owen Wilson and Wes Anderson as writers that like
01:15:19
that was enough to sell him on this project.
01:15:22
Yeah, I do think that that's that's the part to me, I'm like,
01:15:25
man, I think in 1998 this would have hit a lot stronger because
01:15:28
it you just couldn't see what had come next.
01:15:30
And it arguably influenced the careers of someone like Bill
01:15:32
Murray in a way where you don't even question now that he could
01:15:34
play characters like this. But I'm trying to find.
01:15:37
I had read an article. It was like snippets of an
01:15:39
interview he gave, I think around the time the movie was
01:15:41
released, he said. Where does the quote begin?
01:15:46
Precise. A lot of Rushmore is about the
01:15:47
struggle to retain civility and kindness in the face of
01:15:50
extraordinary pain. And I felt a lot of that in my
01:15:53
life. I play a guy who's aware that
01:15:55
his life is not working, but he's still holding on hope
01:15:57
things something will happen. And that's what's most
01:16:00
interesting in life. You never have to completely
01:16:02
quit. So it's almost like an
01:16:03
optimistic reading on both his characters, kind of like
01:16:08
failures in the story and the, like, dogged pursuit from Max
01:16:12
because maybe the most generous reading you could give And what
01:16:15
the movie is sort of intending is like this kids 15.
01:16:19
He's pursuing an adult woman who's a teacher at his own
01:16:22
school. This is inappropriate and will
01:16:24
never work. But at the same time, the
01:16:26
emotions he's feeling are real and to be batted away so
01:16:31
carelessly as to be like, get away from me.
01:16:35
This is stupid. Hurt him anyway.
01:16:37
And I think at some level, the movie is asking you to be like,
01:16:40
hey, guess what? That still hurts, even if you're
01:16:41
being told that your idea was stupid in the first place.
01:16:44
Oh, yeah, absolutely. It's interesting, I guess.
01:16:47
What was Bill? Murray's character then, because
01:16:49
like, we haven't really talked about much what he goes through.
01:16:51
Yeah, I feel like I need to make sure to to cover that.
01:16:53
So Bill Murray is at the beginning of the.
01:16:55
Story again, he's like a rich but kind of listless alumnus of
01:17:00
Rushmore Academy. The first thing you hear, like
01:17:03
the first thing that's implied about him and his relationships
01:17:06
is that his wife is seemingly cheating on him and has no
01:17:09
relationship with him. He has his two sons who were
01:17:11
both just like airheads that he has no strong connection with.
01:17:15
He finds like a compatriot in Max, but then their friendship
01:17:20
gets strained by the fact that they both have feelings for this
01:17:23
same woman. And so he eventually kind of
01:17:27
falls on his face because even like it gets revealed that he
01:17:30
does have a relationship with Miss Cross for a time and it
01:17:34
causes him to get divorced and he loses a bunch of his money
01:17:38
and starts living out of a hotel.
01:17:39
So we kind of end up with like a classic like down on his luck,
01:17:43
dishevelled Bill Murray performance that has maybe some
01:17:47
of the funnier beats in the movies, although they're all in
01:17:49
the movie, although they're all very like, small.
01:17:51
But in the end, he ends up in kind of the same position as
01:17:55
this 15 year old. They both are just struck down
01:17:58
by an effort to achieve the same thing.
01:18:00
Oh yeah. I mean I that that seems like a
01:18:03
juicy role. Like.
01:18:04
Especially like you said, if he'd been doing strictly
01:18:09
Ghostbusters esque comedy roles prior to that.
01:18:12
Like there's a lot for him to dig into there I think.
01:18:15
Again, I'm still looking at the same article which I'll have to
01:18:17
link in the description for this.
01:18:19
Episode so as not to take credit for anything here.
01:18:22
He also said that he felt the script quote showed how a smart
01:18:26
aleck young man could grow into a world weary middle-aged man,
01:18:29
which I think is interesting. It's almost like his character
01:18:31
in Rushmore is the end result of being the like Peter Venkman,
01:18:36
smart ass guy for the first 30-40 years of your life and how
01:18:40
it leaves you just kind of bitter and alone because you
01:18:44
won't open yourself up to anybody.
01:18:47
So it's like a the borderline meta narrative role for him.
01:18:51
And it is a juicy role in the sense that there's a lot to pull
01:18:54
from, but man is it minor. Every expression from him is
01:18:58
pretty small. And I mean really, I think the
01:19:02
the most outlandish. Thing in the whole movie.
01:19:04
Is that there's a part where Max and Bill Murray are talking on
01:19:08
the phone? I don't remember Bill.
01:19:09
I think his name is something Bloom.
01:19:11
He's talking to Max on the phone and trying to convince him to
01:19:13
stop pursuing the teacher woman because he's like, come on, this
01:19:16
is unrealistic. This is there's no reason for
01:19:18
you to do this. You need to let it go.
01:19:20
But at the same time you're seeing that he's like camped
01:19:22
outside the school and it's like he's now peering on this woman
01:19:25
like through a window. But then at one point he's like
01:19:27
walking across the lawn and there's these kids, like little
01:19:30
kids playing with this like 2 foot tall basketball hoop.
01:19:33
And while he has his phone in one hand, one of the kids goes
01:19:35
to shoot the ball and he just like swats the ball really
01:19:38
aggressively all the way to the ground.
01:19:39
And that just keeps going. Like he didn't do that.
01:19:42
It's such a like what? Like that's one of the more just
01:19:44
like goofy bits in the movie. But it's such a like explosion
01:19:47
of energy from such a like, quiet character that it is kind
01:19:50
of funny. That's fun that that is fun.
01:19:53
And that's why you bring in Bill Murray.
01:19:55
To make like something like that work and like a character like
01:19:58
that work. That's what I mean.
01:20:00
I've I've said this with other films that we've reviewed on the
01:20:02
show, like I can't. Assail the movie for failing to
01:20:04
do what it was trying to do, everything Rushmore wanted to
01:20:07
be. It is.
01:20:08
And clearly it was a big enough success that it helped continue
01:20:12
the launchpad for Wes Anderson's career.
01:20:14
So yeah, like it. Not all of the story elements
01:20:16
worked for me, but I think there is still something real being
01:20:20
communicated by it, which is why I would not go as far as to say
01:20:22
like, oh, this movie's bad. I'm like, no, it's pretty good.
01:20:25
I just don't. I wouldn't recommend going back
01:20:27
here unless you're doing it for very like scholarly reasons.
01:20:31
I I think that's a good way to put it, that there's something
01:20:33
real being expressed. By the film at least in its
01:20:38
intention. And that's worth noting.
01:20:42
Like even if it didn't resonate with you or you didn't like it.
01:20:46
Yeah, absolutely. I think that's kind of the job
01:20:48
as a reviewer, you want to be like, here's how this.
01:20:50
Landed for me. Here's why it got there for me.
01:20:53
But that's not to say that's the only experience you could have
01:20:55
watching it. Yeah, yeah.
01:20:57
Like I said, I I if I'd known a little more about it.
01:21:01
Before, probably wouldn't have recommended it.
01:21:04
Probably would have just recommended like maybe a
01:21:06
different Wes Anderson movie from that similar time period.
01:21:11
Oh well. Oh well.
01:21:15
Oh. Fisher, Max.
01:21:17
Fisher. That's his name.
01:21:18
Oh, I was like what I remembered.
01:21:23
HBO Max. Fisher, HBO.
01:21:25
Max Fisher. Yeah.
01:21:27
Anyway, that's it. That's Rushmore.
01:21:29
OK, good. Yeah.
01:21:34
All right. Frank I think it's time we moved
01:21:36
into final scores and then our. Picks for next time.
01:21:40
You went first today with No Escape, so I guess over to you.
01:21:44
Final thoughts, Final score. Well, yeah, like I closed out
01:21:47
the review. I didn't hate No escape.
01:21:50
But I did not love it, so scoring it is a little tricky.
01:21:57
There were things I really liked about it, as I mentioned Walker
01:22:02
from Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles 3.
01:22:05
Fantastic. Love seeing people pop up.
01:22:07
You're like, I didn't even know I was waiting to see them again,
01:22:09
but here. They exactly.
01:22:10
That's a good way to put it. Yes, yes, you've been good with
01:22:13
turning. A phrase this episode.
01:22:15
I'm the best. Remember when I couldn't think
01:22:17
of the guy's name? That was my favorite part.
01:22:22
So yeah, he was great like. The action sequences were
01:22:26
surprisingly fun and like well shot and well executed, which
01:22:30
I'm always a big fan of like well shot action sequences
01:22:35
because I think it's something that like often might get
01:22:38
overlooked. You know, like there's many ways
01:22:41
to shoot people punching at each other and explosions and
01:22:44
whatnot, and there's a way that that really elevates it.
01:22:48
And this did that, even though that wasn't a lot of the movie.
01:22:53
I, I, I do have to give it points for those.
01:22:57
I feel like I'm drifting towards a four.
01:22:59
I think I'm landing on a four for this one, which, oh gosh, I
01:23:03
thought you were heading higher than that.
01:23:05
I it's tough. It's tough like.
01:23:09
I can't. I can't influence the the the
01:23:11
the ranking but. No, no.
01:23:13
It's just I feel like the problem is I didn't I didn't
01:23:15
rate grifters low enough. I didn't create.
01:23:21
A low enough should have been. The floor should have been like
01:23:24
a 0. Yes.
01:23:25
It should have been lower than it is because I feel like a. 4
01:23:29
seems harsh for this movie, but it's not a harsh 4 it's not like
01:23:34
it's not a harsh 4I OK for context because yeah, our
01:23:37
scores. Have now become like a
01:23:38
comparative scale. I gave double impact of four a
01:23:42
long while ago and I still kind of like that movie.
01:23:44
Totally exactly that. And that's how I feel here too,
01:23:47
like and I mean. Like I gave, I gave shoot
01:23:50
fighter a nine. So like, you know, so you're
01:23:54
just the, you're just the dumb guy.
01:23:57
We're just, you know. It's like, like we've said, this
01:24:01
is not something we normally. Do it's.
01:24:03
It's very difficult to just like, take all your mixed
01:24:06
feelings and encapsulate it into a number like this.
01:24:09
If nothing else, Meet Your Double feature proves that
01:24:12
ranking systems. Out of 10 are nonsense yeah,
01:24:16
they're just a difficult thing to do, but.
01:24:18
And so it. It winds up like, you know, kind
01:24:21
of being vibe based towards the end when we get to this point
01:24:25
and and I think it will be interesting.
01:24:26
We've mentioned this maybe on air off before to like go back
01:24:30
later and just I I think kind of discuss some of these films like
01:24:35
at the end of the season and then just maybe see which ones,
01:24:40
like you said, like, hey, you know what, actually I really did
01:24:41
like Double Impact when I scored solo, something like that.
01:24:44
So yeah. But that being said, it's not.
01:24:48
It's not. A strong. 4 It's a four.
01:24:52
I thought it was a strong four. It's a whatever.
01:24:55
It's a four, and thus is how the. .5 was invented.
01:25:02
We're no, we're not doing that, sticking to that.
01:25:05
Like I said, like I said, I should.
01:25:06
Have set a lower. Floor.
01:25:08
To this whole thing. We were too nice, The grifters
01:25:11
at the beginning. Yeah, that movie should have.
01:25:13
Been a one. OK, great.
01:25:15
So that's a four for no escape. That's fine.
01:25:19
I can handle that. I'll bounce back.
01:25:22
Rushmore. I similarly would say that I
01:25:26
thought Rushmore was OK. I didn't hate it.
01:25:27
I didn't love it. But I do think that the thing
01:25:31
that tipped the scales a little bit in its favor is what we
01:25:34
closed in on towards the end of the review, which is that for
01:25:37
all of its shortcomings, Rushmore was speaking to some
01:25:40
kind of real feeling. And that is actually somewhat
01:25:45
rare in a movie, you know? Oh, yeah, totally.
01:25:49
So with that in mind, I. I don't think I can rate
01:25:53
Rushmore. Any lower than a six out of 10.
01:25:55
OK, because respectable 6. I think that surmises all of the
01:25:59
feelings It's. I was a little.
01:26:02
Sleepy watching it, and not just because it was late and I was
01:26:04
sleepy when I started. It has stuff going for it.
01:26:08
I would certainly not recommend anybody go back to Rushmore.
01:26:12
Just pick up with whatever Wes Anderson movie you've seen and
01:26:15
liked and then go forward. You know, we don't need to look
01:26:19
back. I don't know.
01:26:22
There are some ones some of his films.
01:26:24
That I personally want to go back.
01:26:25
And watch just based on the ones of his, like what's the cut off?
01:26:29
You said you saw Life Aquatic. Was that a good one?
01:26:33
Long pause there. I I liked it.
01:26:40
I did not love it. I, I'm, I'm, there's one I've
01:26:43
mentioned to you before that it's been on my watch list for a
01:26:46
while. You know, you have like a
01:26:47
backlog of like films I'll get to eventually.
01:26:49
It's what's the 1:00 where they're on the train where it's,
01:26:54
that's the one that the Wilson brothers are both in, it's
01:26:56
called. The Darjeeling Limited, yes,
01:27:00
very interesting name and, and it's Adrian Brody as well too, I
01:27:02
think. So the pianist.
01:27:08
I don't know why. That got me so good.
01:27:12
He won Best actor. For the pianist, it's just.
01:27:16
The way he said, like the pianist, like he's peeing in it.
01:27:22
But. Sorry, that one.
01:27:27
Like I have high hopes for that one and I've been wanting to.
01:27:30
Watch it for a while. So that'll be like my test, I
01:27:33
think, cuz I'm going to go back at some point, watch that one,
01:27:36
make a definitive decision on Wes Anderson and then never
01:27:39
speak of him ever again. Never speak of him again.
01:27:42
OK. We, yes, I think what that is.
01:27:44
Is we need to find where Wes Anderson reaches equilibrium.
01:27:47
You know, like where can we reach the point where it's like
01:27:49
just stay here, you can go ahead, but do not look back.
01:27:53
Yes, yeah, sure. And we will maybe bring that up
01:27:56
again. Someday, right after we finish
01:27:58
playing No escape. For SNES.
01:28:01
OK, so that is a. 6 for Rushmore a. 4 for no escape.
01:28:07
Frank, this is exciting. You have won the episode.
01:28:10
I told you. I told you all.
01:28:15
He did, actually. Oh man.
01:28:18
I should cut that you've won twice in a row.
01:28:25
The streak is completely broken now.
01:28:26
You won the 1st 2:00 and then I won several and now you are
01:28:29
back-to-back again. Not only that, if we look at the
01:28:32
Season 1 rankings, you've crawled all the way back.
01:28:35
We are one point apart in overall like cumulative scoring
01:28:39
all season. I have 53 points for my films,
01:28:41
you have 52. Wow.
01:28:43
Don't call it a comeback. I can't believe this this.
01:28:46
Is so good for ratings as we head towards the end of season
01:28:49
1. We're going to have to figure
01:28:51
something out. There is a possibility.
01:28:52
To sense in a tie so we'll. See Knowing Knowing our history
01:28:59
of playing video games. For, you know, 30 years.
01:29:02
Yeah, Probably will somehow end in a tie.
01:29:06
Yeah. Yeah.
01:29:07
Oh yeah. Just like the Halo.
01:29:08
Days just like the Halo days. Yeah, I think we decided.
01:29:13
I don't remember if this made it on air, but there was so much
01:29:15
talk about the prophecy movies last time that I think whoever
01:29:17
loses season 1 has to watch all 5 prophecy movies.
01:29:21
I guess if we tie we just both have to do it man.
01:29:25
Yeah, like I'm equal parts like. Looking forward to and dreading
01:29:30
that if it winds up being me, Yeah, that'll be mixed emotions.
01:29:33
You'll like cheer if you don't have to do it, but then you'll
01:29:34
be like, I don't get to. I don't.
01:29:36
I can't. Yeah, that should be if you win,
01:29:37
you're not allowed to watch the prophecy, man.
01:29:41
Like, but then we'd get to like. Cuz then you'd get to like rank
01:29:44
them too and be like, man, well OK, so we all remember Prophecy
01:29:46
3 and then yeah. And you'd have to be like, no, I
01:29:48
wasn't allowed to watch it. Oh man, but.
01:29:54
That's exciting for the folks at home again, and maybe I'll I
01:29:57
should. Episode's full of graphics.
01:29:58
Check out the YouTube version. I'll put up like a leaderboard
01:30:01
with two names on it. Again, I am ahead by the lowest
01:30:07
possible. Margin one.
01:30:08
Point this is episode 9. We've got 3 to go.
01:30:10
So at the end of three more episodes, we'll see who the
01:30:12
overall winner is. But yeah, I guess now let's move
01:30:15
into I I legit I almost wrapped up the episode.
01:30:18
We haven't picked movies. We haven't even finished.
01:30:22
Why don't you just tell me what? Movie you want.
01:30:23
Just tell me what movie? Yeah.
01:30:27
OK. So Frank as the.
01:30:28
Winner for tonight's episode of Meet Your Double Feature.
01:30:30
You get to select first for for next time.
01:30:33
OK, good. I'm glad I'm going first because
01:30:34
I have a question. OK.
01:30:39
Clarification of the rules here because.
01:30:42
If I'm remembering. Correctly, I think this film
01:30:46
that I'm looking at you and I maybe caught like 20 minutes of
01:30:50
this movie on TV together once. So I'm wondering if that
01:30:56
disqualifies it because I would be curious to make you watch the
01:31:01
whole thing. OK, this is a good this is a
01:31:04
good rules conversation. Put up the rules.
01:31:06
Logo editor me put up a Rules logo.
01:31:11
Let's go to Rules. Can we go?
01:31:12
Let's go to the can. We get the interactive.
01:31:14
Rules graphic up please. It's going to be the leaderboard
01:31:19
again. So I think the way that you.
01:31:22
And I handle things. We, we, we keep track of all the
01:31:24
movies we watch just in general, even before the show, we just
01:31:26
write them down in order. And I don't write a film down.
01:31:28
If I didn't like watch the whole thing, even if I was in the
01:31:31
room, but I clearly wasn't paying attention and wasn't
01:31:33
actually like engaged, I won't count that as a viewing.
01:31:36
So I think this is fine. I think if we saw part of it,
01:31:38
but neither of us just actually saw the movie, that's totally
01:31:41
OK. Also, I think I know what this
01:31:43
is. Do you want to guess?
01:31:46
Well, there was one time. Do you know the title?
01:31:50
Shoot, I'm trying to remember the title I.
01:31:52
Remember one time. I flipped on.
01:31:54
To some channel that was showing old movies and we both were so
01:31:58
flummoxed because we just, we usually know.
01:32:00
No, I know what you're thinking of.
01:32:02
It's not actually. It's not 13th.
01:32:04
Floor. It's not 13th floor.
01:32:06
I didn't, I thought. I knew what I was considered
01:32:08
13th. Floor Yeah, No, this goes back.
01:32:11
If I'm remembering correctly. I think this was on one of our
01:32:14
family trips to Indiana and this was on TV and we saw part of it.
01:32:18
I don't know if that helps or hurts.
01:32:20
No, not just tell me the name. Why don't you just tell me what
01:32:23
movie you want? Me to watch.
01:32:28
Yes, this is 1998. Sci-fi psychological thriller
01:32:35
film Sphere Sphere Yes, starring Dustin Hoffman, Sharon Stone and
01:32:41
Sam Jackson. OK, I've I don't have this
01:32:44
memory. When was this?
01:32:46
When did? We watch this was I listen I
01:32:50
could be totally wrong about. This but I think this came on.
01:32:52
TV one time we saw Liev Schreiber is in it too, if that
01:32:55
helps at all. I mean we like Liev Schreiber
01:32:58
but OK. I mean it definitely.
01:33:00
I can do it for the show. I have no memory of this.
01:33:02
That's funny that you're like, remember sphere Just like, I
01:33:07
don't know this guy. This was maybe this this.
01:33:09
This could have been 20 years ago.
01:33:10
That this happened. Like.
01:33:13
Was I like really little? Who knows?
01:33:16
Who knows? OK, anyways, Fear 1998, let me
01:33:19
write that. Down.
01:33:20
That down, write that down. Oh gosh, what a load of build up
01:33:23
to me. Not even knowing what we're
01:33:24
talking about. That's it.
01:33:25
That's. No, that's fine.
01:33:26
That means it's fine. It's good for the show, Yeah.
01:33:29
OK, sci-fi. I haven't really.
01:33:31
Have you given me a sci-fi movie?
01:33:33
Yet. Or is this the first one?
01:33:35
I think it is. Wow, that is shot.
01:33:37
What restraint on my part? Yeah, seriously.
01:33:39
Again, when this show started, I thought I was going to be Now
01:33:42
you watch. This 90s.
01:33:43
Sci-fi action Bee movie. Yeah, yeah.
01:33:46
Which wouldn't be mad about, but here we are.
01:33:50
OK, great. Sphere 1998.
01:33:51
No idea what that is. We.
01:33:53
Almost let the audience in on a cherished family memory, except
01:33:56
I forgot. Well, that's.
01:33:58
It'll be interesting to see if like at.
01:34:00
Some point maybe? It'll wait a minute.
01:34:03
Yeah. So that's my pick for next time
01:34:06
going in a completely. Unrelated direction, our next
01:34:09
episode is going to air on Thanksgiving Day, so if you are
01:34:13
frustrated having dinner with your family and don't want to
01:34:15
talk to them, go ahead and listen to our episode where I'm
01:34:19
going to discuss Sphere and Frank.
01:34:21
You're going to talk about 1990s World War 2 movie Memphis Belle.
01:34:27
What? Look, you're always coming in
01:34:32
here. With your interesting varied
01:34:34
genres. I've done 2 sci Fi's.
01:34:37
You had none. So yeah, you got to watch a
01:34:38
World War Two movie. All right.
01:34:40
I'm not sure what your strategy is here.
01:34:43
Points. But it's not.
01:34:45
I don't know. I think it's OK.
01:34:47
I don't think it's OK. No, no, no.
01:34:48
You're right. You're right.
01:34:49
My phone auto filled that title as.
01:34:52
Mephistopheles. So that's interesting.
01:34:55
Mephistopheles, Bill. Yeah, I don't know.
01:34:57
I just thought like. What's a Thanksgiving?
01:34:59
Atmosphere movie and I was like, I'm just picturing some, I don't
01:35:03
know, people are parents age just caring a lot about World
01:35:06
War Two stories. No, that's hey, you don't have
01:35:09
to. You can do whatever you want.
01:35:11
Oh, you know why somebody recommended it in like a Reddit
01:35:14
thread or something? Because.
01:35:15
They said Eric Stoltz is in it. Remember Eric Stoltz?
01:35:19
Not particularly, but now? Oh, he was the original.
01:35:22
Casting for Marty McFly. And Back to the Future and he
01:35:26
actually filmed, Yeah, he got. Fired though, right?
01:35:30
He they just. Bend him, but not for like a
01:35:32
weird. They basically were just like,
01:35:33
yeah, he's not. Playing as well as we thought
01:35:35
like they filmed for a couple weeks with Eric Stoltz playing
01:35:38
too tall. That's true.
01:35:42
Go check out our. Michael J Fox equals short.
01:35:45
King reel that we have up on our socials for more on that yes, so
01:35:52
I don't know. I just was like, man, I've never
01:35:53
seen him in anything else. Well, what's he up to?
01:35:55
And I just think that we definitely have not covered
01:35:58
World War 2 drama yet on the show.
01:36:00
What's he up to? Eric Stoltz, What does he know?
01:36:04
Does he know? Things.
01:36:05
Does he know things? The Stoltzter?
01:36:07
So yeah, I guess. Man, that's two very different
01:36:10
films for next time, huh? Hey, we always find some
01:36:13
commonality. I don't know if we did this
01:36:14
time. But there's usually some what
01:36:17
was the same? Let's let's meditate on this.
01:36:19
Yeah. Do we know things?
01:36:20
Let's find out. It's about, it's about women, I
01:36:24
think, Or a lack of women. A lack of women, Yeah.
01:36:28
And mandates. Mandates.
01:36:31
Yeah. OK.
01:36:33
So I guess like, do we rap now? Or should we just end on
01:36:36
silence? Actually, yeah, it's a good
01:36:39
point. Everybody after this.
01:36:41
Pause whatever player you're using before it just plays
01:36:44
something else. And we're going to we're going
01:36:46
to meditate for a while on who really won World War 20.
01:36:53
No, Oh no. Coming up next, it's sphere,
01:37:10
followed by. Memphis Belle on Meet Your
01:37:14
Double feature.